Unseen Leadership

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by William Vanerbloemen, CEO and Founder of the Vanderbloemen Search Group, to discuss the topic of leadership and his latest book, “Be the Unicorn: 12 Data-Driven Habits That Separate the Best Leaders from the Rest.” Vanderbloemen shares insights from his research on exceptional leaders and their common habits, aiming to provide people with a guide to becoming exceptional leaders themselves. The interview also delves into Vanderbloemen’s diverse background and experiences, including his time as a pastor and starting his own firm. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 84 “God called us to be fishers of men, not keepers of an aquarium.” – Lyle E. Schaller “The leadership that I had to learn when I was a pastor might be more important now than ever because I had to learn how to get people to follow when they didn't have to.” – William Vanderbloemen “Until you learn your own weaknesses, you won't ever be able to help anybody else.” – William Vanderbloemen “If you're thinking of making a change, the best transitions I've seen are when you sense completion where you are and then a step towards something good that's coming. Don't just step away from your job with nothing in hand. If you've completed what you were called to do and you're headed towards something new, there's a higher likelihood that you're walking in step with the rhythm that you need to.” – William Vanderbloemen “Particularly in 18-35-year-olds, they get a job offer and then they counter. Obviously, if they're not paying you fairly, then you can have that conversation. But there are so many times I see people in that age range counteroffer and shoot themselves in the foot. Even if they land the job and get the counter, they're starting workday one with the label of that the guy knows everything. I think the longer, slower, more successful play is to prove yourself, and you'll never have to ask for a raise.” – William Vanderbloemen I think particularly if you're a new leader where you're serving some people that are older than you, go ask them to tell you about the best days of this company or the best days of this church. You can learn so much by learning the history of where you've been.” – William Vanderbloemen RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Be the Unicorn: 12 Data-Driven Habits that Separate the Best Leaders from the Rest by William Vanderbloemen Einstein: His Life and Universe by Walter Isaacson Atomic Habits: An Easy & Proven Way to Build Good Habits & Break Bad Ones by James Clear Wisdom from Lyle E. Schaller: The Elder Statesman of Church Leadership by Lyle E. Schaller and Warren Bird

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Garrett Kell, who serves as the Lead Pastor of Del Ray Baptist Church in Alexandria, Virginia. During this podcast, he discusses his leadership journey and his role in revitalizing Del Ray Baptist Church. Garrett also shares insights into being a leader guided by God, the importance of relationships, and the use of social media to share the gospel in a relatable way. He also discusses his experiences in various leadership roles before and after becoming a Christian, emphasizing the value of stewarding influence and pointing people toward Jesus. Kell provides insights into church revitalization, focusing on the need for intentional change, preaching the Word, and prayer. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 83 “Be led by God before you lead others. Whatever area of influence God has placed you in, He's put you there to be faithful with whatever is entrusted. But it's always in the context of relationships. So whether you're a pastor or a plumber, whether you're a politician or whatever it is that you do, you should seek to be led by God so that as you're influencing others, you're influencing them toward Him, and not away from Him.” – Garrett Kell “In one sense, whether you're planting a church or revitalizing being a part of revitalization, you're pastoring. And the question is, do you want to make your own mess or clean up someone else's mess?” – Garrett Kell “Be careful with your words and seek to serve people, not use them as props.” – Garrett Kell “Disconnect from social media regularly to minimize distractions and be present in the moment.” – Garrett Kell “Part of being a pastor is being willing to be led by the Word and let God do the work, even when it’s uncomfortable.” – Garrett Kell “I think serving and ministering out of a place of passion is important. Don't try to replicate something everybody else does.” – Garrett Kell The safest people for me love me and care about me. They want me to love God, love my family, and make it to heaven, and they are not impressed with me.” – Garrett Kell RECOMMENDED RESOURCES A Time to Mourn: Grieving the Loss of Those Whose Eternities Were Uncertain by Will Dobbie A Call to Prayer by J.C. Ryle Overcoming Apathy: Gospel Hope for Those Who Struggle to Care by Uche Anizor You're Not Crazy: Gospel Sanity for Weary Churches by Ray Ortlund, Sam Alberry, and Russell Moore Delighting in the Trinity: An Introduction to the Christian Faith by Michael Reeves No Greater Love; A Biblical Vision for Friendship by Rebecca McLaughlin Our Daily Bread App Speechify App

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Spence Shelton, the lead pastor of Mercy Church in Charlotte, North Carolina. Shelton discusses the challenges and mistakes he has made as a church planter and shares valuable insights and advice for leaders in the church and ministry context. He emphasizes the importance of humility, courage, and listening to others in leadership, drawing on his background in the business world to inform his approach to ministry. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 82 “Working in the marketplace really helped me to not only know the experience but also think well through the programming of our church and how are we equipping the saints for ministry where they are.” – Spence Shelton “There is a level of professionalism that I want to bring to our ministry, but not for the sake of looking polished. Rather, I want them to feel like they can trust their church and there's a level of professionalism that communicates trust.” – Spence Shelton “Find a relationship where there's somebody who's got some experience and let them call out what they see God doing in your life.” – Spence Shelton “One of the biggest lessons I’ve had to learn in my leadership as well as my character development is having to take my hands off of more and more things and trust the people that God has called into leading alongside me and under my leadership.” – Spence Shelton “Your job is to equip the saints for ministry and if you try and control the saints instead of equip them, that vision is never going to become a reality.” – Spence Shelton If I don’t keep my fingers off what my staff is doing, they're going to feel like they're being micromanaged, and they can't lead. Plus, young leaders can't be developed if old leaders are gripping their ministry.” – Spence Shelton “Empower your people, equip them, and release them for ministry. Don't try and micromanage them and control them.” – Spence Shelton “A little bit of experience is way worse than no experience. A little bit of experience is way more dangerous than no experience.” – Spence Shelton “Be willing to fail because if you don't, you're not going to risk anything. People need vision and vision is a risk so be willing to fail. But, in all things, have humility.” – Spence Shelton “If you have humility, then you will take courageous risks that will be surrounded by wisdom because you'll be listening to others and everything else.” – Spence Shelton The biggest misconception I had about leadership was that my ideas would be enough. If I just had good ideas, that'd be enough. Now, ideas are important. Vision is important. But relationships matter. You will not get far just on an idea. Especially in ministry, you're not going to get far as a leader unless you're a servant leader.” – Spence Shelton RECOMMENDED RESOURCES The Emotionally Healthy Leader: How Transforming Your Inner Life Will Deeply Transform Your Church, Team, and the World by Peter Scazzero The Reformed Pastor: The Duties and Methods of Labors for the Souls of Men by Richard Baxter The Art of War by Sun Tzu The Rise and Triumph of the Modern Self: Cultural Amnesia, Expressive Individualism, and the Road to Sexual Revolution by Carl R. Trueman Dangerous Calling: Confronting the Unique Challenges of Pastoral Ministry by Paul David Tripp The Culture Code: The Secrets of Highly Successful Groups by Daniel Coyle

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Mark Gauthier, the Vice President of Cru, and Director of its U.S. operations. They discuss the mission and vision of Cru as a worldwide Christian ministry and Gauthier shares how Cru focuses on leadership and personal growth, encouraging young leaders to step out in faith and trust in God's provision. He also touches on his own experiences and pivotal moments in his life, highlighting upcoming opportunities for Cru at the World Cup in 2026 and the Open Window Partnership in the Middle East. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 81 “Readiness is important. Yes, we want to keep developing our skills, but I don't think it's ever a prerequisite for leadership.” – Mark Gauthier “God isn't necessarily asking you to take a job for the rest of your life. Just take the next right step.” – Mark Gauthier “Our leadership, wherever we are contributing, comes from within, and we lead out of who we are. I think the most significant person you must lead is yourself.” – Mark Gauthier “Sometimes the best indicator that you're doing the right thing is that it’s going to cause your faith to grow.” – Mark Gauthier “There are 8 billion people in the world and every one of us is made uniquely in the image of God. That means that He knows that we all have a specific way that we connect with Him, and we're not all the same.” – Mark Gauthier “Note-taking is a form of me just expressing humility in that I want to learn.” – Mark Gauthier “Ask for feedback, it's so important. It's easy for our confidence to outstrip our character.” – Mark Gauthier “Leadership is going to be a walk of faith. Give yourself grace. Give yourself patience. God has got you, and He's going to give you what you need when you need it.” – Mark Gauthier RECOMMENDED RESOURCES God's Smuggler by Brother Andrew and John and Elizabeth Sherrill The Splendid and the Vile: A Saga of Churchill, Family, and Defiance During the Blitz by Erik Larson Boundaries: When to Say Yes, How to Say No to Take Control of Your Life by Henry Cloud and John Townsend Life Without Lack: Living in the Fullness of Psalm 23 by Dallas Willard Jesus Film Project

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Josh King, Lead pastor of Second Baptist in Conway, Arkansas. In the episode, Josh discusses his journey in ministry, starting at the age of 18, and emphasizes the importance of investing in established churches and valuing their resources and legacy. He highlights the need for young leaders to prepare themselves for leadership roles by immersing themselves in the environments and practices of their desired positions and learning from experienced leaders. Through his own experiences and mentorship, Josh encourages young leaders to recognize and affirm the callings of others, empowering them to step into their leadership roles with confidence. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 80 “When you see a calling within somebody and in their life, call it out. Giving that confidence to somebody is huge and affirming.” – Josh King “There is a big difference between saying someone is ready for ministry and simply telling them they are called.” – Josh King “Don't wait until you have the job. Start learning now by hanging out with people who are actively doing what you want to do and pick it up as you can.” – Josh King “A shift for me was not being bitter about not being the trendy, cool, leader with all these special giftings, but instead, just embracing whom God created me to be.” – Josh King “We can be so tempted to get go ahead and get to a decision, but things like struggling with a committee, or struggling with some deacons or some lay leaders, there's discipleship in that.” – Josh King “If you can see the beauty in the minutia and in the journey, I would have learned quicker to bring my eyes down a little bit and to see the now, not just the next.” – Josh King “We love leadership so much, yet over and over Scripture puts a greater emphasis on following in that, great leaders are actually just great followers. And God gives a following to those who are great followers.” – Josh King “If you worry more about following Christ and about submitting to the godly leaders in your life, the leadership will come later. That's how you get developed.” – Josh King “God is not going to hold you responsible for the mess that you found. He's just holding you responsible for what you do in it.” – Josh King RECOMMENDED RESOURCES The God Who Goes Before You: Pastoral Leadership as Christ-Centered Followership by Timothy Paul Jones and Michael S. Wilder Shepherd Leadership: Wisdom for Leaders from Psalm 23 by Blaine McCormick and David Davenport

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Vance Pitman, President of the Send Network, and former pastor of Hope Church in Las Vegas. This episode explores the theme of leadership in the context of church planting and ministry. Pitman shares his insights and experiences, emphasizing the importance of succession and focusing on the kingdom of God rather than personal success. He also discusses his journey as a church planter in Las Vegas and the unique challenges and opportunities he has faced in ministering to a non-Christian population. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 79 “Jesus focused more on succession than He did on success. And I think that's an issue in the church and American leadership in America. Today, we focus on success without even thinking about succession. Jesus was just the opposite. If you look at His public ministry, it was not even successful. 120 people after three and a half years wouldn't get him any book deal or invitation to speak at any conference, but that 120 became 120,000 because He focused on succession knowing it was bigger than just His life. I think that's something we got to get focused towards.” – Vance Pitman “The church is just a temporary tool established by Jesus for the expansion of the kingdom. The real end game is the kingdom of God around the throne of Jesus for every tribe, tongue, people, and nation.” – Vance Pitman “The primary call on my life is not to do something for Jesus, the primary call of my life is to be with Jesus. And everything Jesus wants to do through my life, He'll do out of the overflow of what He's doing in my life.” – Vance Pitman “The greatest thing you bring to your role as a leader is your personal intimate relationship with Jesus because everything that He wants to do through you as a leader, He'll do in you. The key to learning about being a leader is before I can be a leader, I must be a devoted follower. The key to my success as a leader is the devotion that I pursue Christ with as a devoted follower. And as a follower of Jesus, He then begins to lead through us in ways that we would never dream possible.” – Vance Pitman “As much as you schedule appointments, as much as you schedule time with the family as much as you schedule time to sleep at night, you have to build rest and whitespace or margin into your calendar.” – Vance Pitman “We will never, never grow healthy churches with unhealthy leaders.” – Lance Witt “We have neglected the fact that a pastor's greatest leadership tool is a healthy soul.” – Lance Witt “I think one of the reasons that the church in North America is struggling today is because we have spiritually unhealthy leadership. When you look at the kingdom of God, globally, there are only two continents in the world where Christianity is declining. One of them is North America, and North America has the most resources, the most buildings, the most budget, the most staff the most degrees, and the most education the most. Why are we not seeing the kingdom expand? I think it's directly related to the spiritual health of those who are leading.” – Vance Pitman “Starting a church service is not planting a church. Biblical missiology is that planting a church starts with the city. You engage that city with the gospel, you make disciples, and churches are born as a byproduct.” – Vance Pitman “Leadership is lonely, but it cannot be done alone. Leadership demands that we bring other people to the table to lead alongside us.” – Vance Pitman “You cannot lead what you do not live long term. You can fake it in the short run. Authenticity in leadership is important and if you're not living it, you won't be able to lead it over the long haul. – Vance Pitman RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Replenish: Leading from a Healthy Soul by Lance Witt Gentle and Lowly: The Heart of Christ for Sinners and Sufferers by Dane Ortlund The Stressless Life: Experiencing the Unshakable Presence...

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Tod Bolsinger, who is a speaker, executive coach, former pastor, and author who serves as associate professor of leadership formation and senior fellow for the De Pree Center for Leadership at Fuller Seminary. In this episode, Bolsinger discusses his background in leadership roles, including his experience in pastoral ministry and the pivotal moment that changed his approach to leadership. They also discuss the importance of adaptive leadership and building trust with followers, while also prioritizing the mission of organizations over personal recognition and success. This episode provides insights into Bolsinger's leadership journey and his approach to leading in a rapidly changing world. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 78 “You need trust for transformation, but trust is not true transformation. You being a highly trusted leader doesn't mean anybody's being changed. As a matter of fact, sometimes it means they will let you be the proxy for their formation and what you must learn is how to figure out how to invest that trust in calling people toward genuine transformation. That's what adaptive leadership is.” – Tod Bolsinger “The most important thing about our fruitfulness is that we are faithful to our mission. So obviously, the mission always wins. It's the mission, not the pastor, not the congregants, not the people the path the voices of the past, not the people. It's the mission.” – Tod Bolsinger “The hardest thing for me today is owning that the group is smarter than I am. But I'm not here to impress anybody. I'm here to express what God wants to do.” – Tod Bolsinger When you're experiencing conflict, what so many try to do is stop the conflict when what we need to do is learn from the conflict.” – Tod Bolsinger “The most soul-sucking thing for most leaders is not the challenges of the world, it's the resistance of your own people in your own congregation. It's your own team.” – Tod Bolsinger “Leaders are formed in the leading. So, if you're having a challenge right now, it's not that you messed up, missed a class, or didn't read a book. This is normal. It's normal for you because you became a leader right after you were good at something that was not leading.” – Tod Bolsinger “You become a leader in the crisis of leadership and the crucible of leadership. You must develop honest, vulnerable self-reflection. If you are only defending yourself, you will never be able to be open enough to the shaping that God wants to do in your life.” – Tod Bolsinger “A leader asking for loyalty is a sign of dysfunction almost every time.” – Tod Bolsinger RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Tempered Resilience: How Leaders Are Formed in the Crucible of Change by Tod Bolsinger Canoeing the Mountains: Christian Leadership in Uncharted Territory by Tod Bolsinger Thriving through Ministry Conflict: A Parable on How Resistance Can Be Your Ally by James P. Osterhaus, Joseph M. Jurkowski, and Todd A. Hahn

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Shane Pruitt, the national Next Gen director for the North American Mission Board. This episode discusses the importance of calling out future ministry leaders while highlighting the need for current leaders to focus on and mentor the next generation of leaders. Pruitt also shares his personal journey from a lost young man to a successful ministry leader and emphasizes the significance of guiding and mobilizing young adults and college students with the gospel of Jesus Christ. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 77 “I think we as current leaders have stopped on a large scale asking a whole generation to consider if God's calling them the ministry leadership.” – Shane Pruitt “A lot of times God will affirm that inside affirmation from outside affirmation from others.” – Shane Pruitt “Ministry calling is not something that you have to chase in a sense, it will chase you down. If God is calling you, He will give you opportunities to exercise that whatever that is.” – Shane Pruitt “Lead from the overflow of your own worship of King Jesus and lead from the overflow of your own proximity with the Holy Spirit.” – Shane Pruitt “The bride of Christ is beautiful, no matter what size. Sometimes there are large churches because they're faithful to the gospel. And then there are some churches that are normative, or what others may consider smaller, and they're faithful to the gospel. They're being salt and light in their community.” – Shane Pruitt “Our identity should not be wrapped up in results or in pleasing people but being obedient to LORD all the way to the end.” – Shane Pruitt RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Calling Out the Called: Discipling Those Called to Ministry Leadership by Shane Pruitt Spiritual Leadership: Principles of Excellence for Every Believer by J. Oswald Sanders Billy Graham: The Man I Knew by Greg Laurie

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by Ben Stuart, the pastor of Passion City Church in Washington, DC. Ben shares his leadership journey and the different roles he has held in ministry, including his experience as a youth pastor and his current position at Passion City Church. He emphasizes the importance of consistent leadership, and the impact leaders have on those around them. Ben also shares insights on student leadership at Texas A&M University and the value of serving and following God's leading rather than seeking the spotlight. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 76 “Don't chase the spotlight. Don't chase the mic. Chase the Lord. And He's going to lead you where you need to go. You keep learning, you keep growing, you keep serving, and He's going to elevate you.” – Ben Stuart “What seems like a great moment of failure might be a step into your biggest victory.” – Ben Stuart “Sometimes God is going to make you sit on something for a long time to sharpen your vision of it.” – Ben Stuart “Just be faithful to the reveal that's in front of you. Don't try to play chess with your life. Sometimes you just must be faithful to what's in front of you.” – Ben Stuart “Don’t hurry up and grab a thing, position, or title to validate your existence. That's such an unhealthy dangerous place to be. The older I get, the more grateful I am that God hid me from any spotlights and surrounded me with good mentors.” – Ben Stuart “You really need to make sure that you trust someone's character and that you have chemistry with another person before you put them in a position of leadership because your job as a leader is to protect the culture. Of course, you want one that's filled with grace and truth, humility, and a commitment to the Word of God. So, you’ve got to be careful whom you hand the mantle of leadership to.” – Ben Stuart RECOMMENDED RESOURCES 1776 by David McCullough Passion 2024 The Master Plan of Evangelism by Dr. Robert E. Coleman and Billy Graham

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership Podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Dan Iten are joined by David Platt, who is the Lead Pastor at McLean Bible Church and founder of Radical, who discusses his journey in ministry and the importance of intimacy with God. He emphasizes prioritizing a biblical gospel over an American one that values comfort, power, and politics. Platt's new book, "Don't Hold Back: Leaving Behind the American Gospel to Follow Jesus Fully," explores topics such as unity in the church, justice with the gospel, and the beauty of a multi-ethnic bride of Christ. Platt also shares a pivotal moment in his personal life where his wife's wake-up call led him to embrace spiritual disciplines such as meditation, prayer, fasting, exercise, and sleep. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 75 “I don't think it was just an American dream that was captivating our hearts, I think there's been an American gospel that's been consuming our lives.” – David Platt “A gospel that exchanges the biblical gospel that exalts Jesus above everything in the world for an American version of it prostitutes Jesus for the sake of comfort and power and politics and prosperity in our country. It has ravaged the church in many ways and our witness, not just in our country, but to the ends of the earth.” – David Platt “What frightens me is how successful in the eyes of the world that I could be in ministry and do it totally apart from intimacy with Jesus.” – David Platt “Don't try to manufacture a heart for ministry and miss a heart for Jesus or you’ll miss the whole point.” – David Platt “Of course, it’s unhelpful if you never act on anything and you're just always indecisive, but at the same time, be wise in learning and listening before deciding or acting to learn that balance or that tension of when it's healthy to move forward.” – David Platt That's part of what leadership is which is to shepherd people toward where God's calling you to go and not just telling them to go there and expecting it to happen.” – David Platt “Be afraid of leading apart from intimacy with Jesus.” – David Platt RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Don't Hold Back: Breaking Free from the American Gospel to Follow Jesus Fully by David Platt For the Love of God: A Daily Companion for Discovering the Riches of God's Word by D.A. Carson Waiting on God: A 31-Day Adventure into the Heart of God by Andrew Murray

In this episode of the 5 Leadership Questions podcast, Todd Adkins and Dan Iten are joined by Chuck Peters, who serves as the Director of Lifeway Kids and Scott McConnell, who serves as the Executive Director of Lifeway Research. In this episode, they discuss the current trends, challenges, and needs of Generation Z and Generation Alpha in kids’ ministry. The conversation highlights the importance of adapting to the needs of younger generations, creating a culture of belonging, and addressing the need for identity. They also talk about Lifeway's book called “Flip the Script” which is a resource that offers tools for preschool kids and student ministries to effectively reach Gen Z and Alpha. Overall, the episode provides valuable insights for church leaders seeking to connect with and minister to younger generations. BEST QUOTES "We can't do what we've always done and expect a different outcome." – Chuck Peters "The biggest disconnect is assuming that kids think how we do." – Chuck Peters "The most connected generation in history through technology is simultaneously the loneliest and most isolated generation ever." – Scott McConnell "We have an epidemic of loneliness, of isolation, of separation. In real life, kids don't have real relationships." – Scott McConnell "We need to create a culture of belonging and speak to the need for identity among younger generations." – Chuck Peters "Once they find a place to belong, it heavily influences their identity." – Chuck Peters "We as the church have to adapt, based on the research, to use different approaches to connect with kids in ways that are actually meaningful." – Scott McConnell RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Flip the Script: Disrupting Tradition for the Sake of the Next Generation by Chuck Peters, Jana Magruder, and Stephanie Salvatore Hyfi: A Digital Curriculum to Reach the Next Generation of Kids and Students

In this episode of the 5 Leadership Questions podcast, Todd Adkins, Chandler Vannoy, and Dan Iten discuss the subject of how to conduct better, more effective meetings in whatever leadership setting you find yourself. Here are some of the questions asked during the episode: Why are meetings important for the local church? Why is it important to gather volunteers or others who aren’t paid staff? What are some best practices or opposing views about getting the most out of your team meetings? What are some good filters on how to determine what a meeting is about and whether something should be a meeting at all? What are some real-life examples of leading a team meeting well? How are meetings conducted in an effective manner in a much smaller context? Are there any resources that would be helpful in learning how to conduct more effective meetings? BEST QUOTES “You should not have a meeting to decide on what the question or the point of the meeting is.” – Todd Adkins “If you've got layers of teams, those should be done from a development standpoint to check in and make sure somebody's continuing to grow, or you're able to address any issues.” – Todd Adkins “I think it's really important to let your participants know in advance what type of meeting that's going to be so they can they you know that you have an agenda and a purpose for it.” – Dan Iten “Part of the issue with most meetings and why people feel like they're a waste of time is they don't get anywhere; they don't move things forward.” – Todd Adkins “Nothing frustrates a participant more than leaving a meeting feeling clueless about next steps.” – Dan Iten “Everything is a coaching moment.” – Todd Adkins “Coaching is not just critique; it is also encouragement.” – Todd Adkins “I don't care whether you're in a big church or a small church, everybody has an opinion on the way they make decisions.” – Todd Adkins “The cardinal sin of the modern day is wasting someone's time.” – Todd Adkins “Don't try to do a team meeting just because you feel that need to gather everyone together.” – Dan Iten RECOMMENDED RESOURCES Death by Meeting: A Leadership Fable...About Solving the Most Painful Problem in Business by Patrick Lencioni The Coming Church Revolution: Empowering Leaders for the Future by Carl F. George 90 Second Leadership Starters

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Jamie Ivey who is the host of the Happy Hour with Jamie Ivey podcast. She is also the author of several books, including her most recent children's book God Made You to Be You. During their conversation, they discuss using our gifts for other people to see His works and give glory to God for them, being comfortable in who God made you to be, and how to learn more about what you are gifted for. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 74: "If I am struggling and I think my gifts are small today, I still can believe that God has given them to me so that people will see them and give glory to God.""God is bringing you up as a leader and He has prepared things for you to do.""I am not trying to put on a show, I am just trying to be myself and I think God has used that in a lot of people's lives.""I had to go through a lot of laying stuff down with God - insecurities and feeling not enough.""He has equipped those who He has called and I am going to keep walking forward.""You do bring something to the table, not because you are awesome, but because God has gifted you.""Practically, one of the best things for me has been to step in and serve. Sign up to teach a class and see what happens.""Sometimes we get in the wrong mindset of thinking that what someone else is doing equals success.""Success is individualized and so many times is a moving target.""I want to look at people I can learn from, but I don't want to chase their successes. I want to chase faithfulness and what God has called me to do." RESOURCES MENTIONED God Made You to Be You by Jamie Ivey You Be You by Jamie Ivey Unseen Leadership Episode 2: Jamie Ivey on Dealing With Your Past and Sharing Your Struggles With Others

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Derwin Gray who is the founding and lead pastor of Transformation Church. He is also the author of The Good Life and his new book, God, Do You Hear Me?. During their conversation, they discuss how prayer is the posture of our hearts, how prayer leads to better ministry, and how your prayer life affects how you preach. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 73: "Leadership is not telling people what to do. Leadership is embodying what you want others to become.""Prayer is a posture of our hearts to the divine presence of God in everything.""We often live out of our family of origin wounding rather than our new family of origin and our Father.""As a leader The Lord's Prayer not only shows us intimacy, but also The Lord's Prayer is God's will for our lives.""Weak people pray to a strong God. People who think they are strong don't pray to God.""Prayer is a posture of dependence and need.""We should never get good at ministry because we will get bad at prayer.""A prayerless preacher is a powerless preacher.""Don't mistake big crowds for big power.""If the redemptive work of Jesus is not the plumb line to everything, then it is not a Christian message.""Prayer is the heartbeat that pumps the blood out of the message.""Do not look for content to preach. Look for content to live." RESOURCES MENTIONED God, Do You Hear Me? by Derwin Gray The Good Life by Derwin Gray Unseen Leadership Episode 37: Derwin Gray on Focusing on Discipleship More Than Leadership Conformed to His Image by Kenneth Boa

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Sandra McCracken who is a prolific songwriter, modern day hymn writer, and record producer. She is also an author of her new book Send Out Your Light. During their conversation, they discuss how a song can connect people, that leadership can take on different forms based on personality types, and the two sides of ego and that challenge that causes. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 72: "I was pretty shy as a kid, and I didn't want to be upfront. Songwriting was a way by which I could contribute and put words to something we all shared and then it could become communal.""No matter what field you are in, we are all creative.""There are all these ways we express the creativity of God - for me it is songwriting.""We have a shared human experience because this is God's world and He has made things in a way that He can speak to us through these things in the same way.""Leadership can actually be a quiet thing. You don't have to be some big personality that wants to be upfront all the time.""Leadership that reflects your personality type could take a lot of different forms.""The way we manage our pride and humility is the biggest challenge of working together in groups and a team.""If you are starting something new, you can expect that growth is going to be uncomfortable sometimes." RESOURCES MENTIONED Send Out Your Light by Sandra McCracken Hearing the Call by Nicholas Wolterstorff Lament for a Son by Nicholas Wolterstorff Hearing God by Dallas Willard This Episode's Sponsor: Our sponsor, BELAY, is offering all our podcast listeners a free download of their resource, ‘5 Ways A Church Bookkeeper Can Transform Your Day,’ which shares the five most positive changes that will come out of hiring a bookkeeper for your church. Just text LIFEWAY to 55123 or visit belaysolutions.com/lifeway to download it for free today!

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Dr. Scott James who is a pediatric physician and an elder at The Church at Brook Hills in Birmingham, Alabama. He is also the author of two devotions, The Expected One and The Risen One. During their conversation, they discuss how leadership is letting others flourish, investing in a local church, and making a purposeful shift between work and home. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 71: "My biggest misconception was that leadership, in and of itself, is defined as an active, out front, action-oriented role.""If you are surrounded with good people, you don't have to drag them from up front. You support them from behind and let them thrive and flourish in what God has already gifted them to do.""Wherever you are, whatever role God has you in, invest your life in a good, local church.""Making that commitment to a local church then puts you in a position to serve other people.""When pivoting between things, I will stop, pray, and do something that is a very concrete shifting of gears.""Stay humble, keep your head down, do the work in front of you.""Most people that step into a leadership position have this expectation that they need to do grandiose things right out of the gate. I think plodding is the better course." RESOURCES MENTIONED The Expected One by Scott James The Risen One by Scott James Gentle and Lowly by Dane Ortlund Every Moment Holy The Wolf Hall Trilogy by Hilary Mantel This Episode's Sponsor: Our sponsor, BELAY, is offering all our podcast listeners a free download of their resource, ‘5 Ways A Church Bookkeeper Can Transform Your Day,’ which shares the five most positive changes that will come out of hiring a bookkeeper for your church. Just text LIFEWAY to 55123 or visit belaysolutions.com/lifeway to download it for free today!

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Gregg Matte who is the senior pastor of Houston's First Baptist Church and the founder of Breakaway Ministries at Texas A&M University. He is also the author of many books including his upcoming devotional, Capture the Moment. During their conversation, they discuss leading through your God-given identity, the three-legged stool of calling, and the need for grace in learning. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 70: "Pray for leadership and wisdom every day.""I really value peace, and that is a tough one for a leader.""If I can be myself and walk with God, number one I am going to honor Him, and number two I am going to be able to lead.""Calling is: Do I want to? Do people respond when I do it? And does God want me to?""My high value of peace negated my need to be clear.""I want to make a good, clear decision, but I'd like to do it and keep the body of Christ unified.""Give your mornings to God, your afternoons to the church, and your evenings to your family.""Do not sell your family on the alter of ministry.""Realize you are continually learning, and, therefore, show yourself grace." RESOURCES MENTIONED Unstoppable Gospel by Gregg Matte Difference Makers by Gregg Matte Capture the Moment by Gregg Matte Spiritual Leadership by Oswald Sanders The Seven Money Types by Tommy Brown This Episode's Sponsor: Our sponsor, BELAY, is offering all our podcast listeners a free download of their resource, ‘5 Ways A Church Bookkeeper Can Transform Your Day,’ which shares the five most positive changes that will come out of hiring a bookkeeper for your church. Just text LIFEWAY to 55123 or visit belaysolutions.com/lifeway to download it for free today!

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Coach Mark Richt who is the former head football coach of the University of Georgia Bulldogs and the University of Miami Hurricanes and a longtime assistant coach for the Florida State University Seminoles. He is currently a football analyst for the ACC network. He is also the author of his new book, Make the Call. During their conversation, they discuss how to know if you are making good decisions, the importance of being genuine, and being a good steward of the influence that God has given you. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 69: "It's hard for faith and fear to live in the same mind.""My fear was stronger than my faith and God helped me grow my faith like I asked for.""If you are making a big decision and your goal is to try to please somebody or some group of people that can be dangerous.""My goal was to make a decision that God would be pleased with and my gauge on whether I did that or not was how I felt when I put my head on the pillow at night.""To try to change your personality to be somebody your not, first of all takes too much energy, and maybe more importantly, people under you are going to see you aren't genuine.""If you do something for someone who can't help you back it changes the way you look at life.""You can change any cycle that has been going on in your home.""Within a couple generations you might affect 50 to 100 people's lives because you decided you were going to man up.""One size doesn't fit all when it comes to capturing the heart of a player or a person, a wife or a child. They all feel love different ways.""God said, 'I will certainly be with you.' If you know that, then you can make it. If you make the mistake of thinking it's all you, that is when you get crushed." RESOURCES MENTIONED Make the Call by Mark Richt The 5 Love Languages by Gary Chapman Kingdom Man by Tony Evans This Episode's Sponsor: Our sponsor, BELAY, is offering all our podcast listeners a free download of their resource, ‘5 Ways A Church Bookkeeper Can Transform Your Day,’ which shares the five most positive changes that will come out of hiring a bookkeeper for your church. Just text LIFEWAY to 55123 or visit belaysolutions.com/lifeway to download it for free today!

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Mitchel Lee who is the lead pastor of Grace Community Church in Fulton, Maryland. He is also the author of Even If. During their conversation, they discuss how going through a wilderness period leads to better leadership, leading with courage and humility, and the slow work of building culture. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 68: "What I learned during that wilderness period was that charismatic people are a dime a dozen. It is people with character that stay and that the Lord uses.""Look at the biblical testimony. What leader do you see that doesn't go through the wilderness?""When we are cultivating that intimacy with the Lord before the valley comes, it makes us able to endure the valley in that transformative way.""There are no wasted years in the kingdom of God.""Do not underestimate the formative power of obscurity.""Lead out of your convictions.""It's so easy to try to think about how to lead so that each person feels placated. There is no win in that situation.""They don't have to be my best friends, but I do have a responsibility to stay relationally connected with my team.""If you want to build something that will outlast you, you have to build culture.""You have to have an urgency for the long haul." RESOURCES MENTIONED Even If by Mitchel Lee The Second Mountain by David Brooks In the Name of Jesus by Henri Nouwen Emotionally Healthy Discipleship by Peter Scazzero A Failure of Nerve by Edwin Friedman Life of the Beloved by Henri Nouwen This Episode's Sponsor: Our sponsor, BELAY, is offering all our podcast listeners a free download of their resource, ‘5 Ways A Church Bookkeeper Can Transform Your Day,’ which shares the five most positive changes that will come out of hiring a bookkeeper for your church. Just text LIFEWAY to 55123 or visit belaysolutions.com/lifeway to download it for free today!

In this episode of the Unseen Leadership podcast, Chandler Vannoy and Mike Kelsey are joined by Jimmy Scroggins who is the lead pastor at Family Church in West Palm Beach, Fl. He is also the author of Turning Everyday Conversations into Gospel Conversations and Full Circle Parenting. During their conversation, they discuss discerning the Lord's call, leading through love or fear, and thinking holistically about balancing family relationships and work. QUOTES FROM EPISODE 67: "If you are in leadership, you can't lead without conflict. You are going to be frustrated from time to time wherever you are in leadership.""Learning the power of chemistry and culture in leadership was important.""If you don't have some kind of a plan, your head is going to be on a swivel all of the time.""Consider your life in seasons, and almost time block your commitments so that your head is not on a swivel all of the time.""You are going to be blown around by opportunities and you are never going to be able to give the right amount of energy to what God has in front of you right now today.""You've got to love people for them, not for what they do for you.""There are two levers you pull as a leader: you are either leading through love or you are leading through fear.""I undervalued the power of institutions and I undervalued the wisdom of veteran leaders.""As a Christian thinker, we should think of ourselves holistically all the time.""I hope that I have learned to lead out of a desire to love and serve others more than desire for other people to think I am somebody." RESOURCES MENTIONED Turning Everyday Conversations into Gospel Conversations by Jimmy Scroggins Full Circle Parenting by Jimmy Scroggins Good to Great by Jim Collins Gentle and Lowly by Dane Ortlund Excellence Wins by Horst Schulze Downline Ministries' mission is to encourage a restoration of biblical discipleship in and through the local church by equipping men and women to know God's Word and make disciples. The primary way we partner with churches is through the Downline Institute, a 9 month biblical discipleship training program that walks students through the Bible (Genesis-Revelation), biblical manhood/womanhood, and key discipleship lessons. Listeners can receive $100 off tuition cost by using the code LIFEWAY when you apply at www.downlineministries.com.