Business of Apps Podcast

Yet another summer is wizzed by with a jet speed. With a few days left, we want to signify this moment by sharing with you yet another App Talk interview from App Promotion Summit London 2025, this time with Rui Mateus, CTO of Mobrand. At the interview, Rui brilliantly laid out the state of programmatic advertising for mobile apps. He touched on the need for control and transparency in programmatic, the performance-based model, scaling and rebranding, ad fraud challenges, the role of AI in programmatic, and more. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Rui Mateus on LinkedInMobrand websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Rui Mateus “I consider that Mobrand is not necessarily a marketing company. It’s a tech company. We have a very big technological background, and when you have the technology, you have the control — and then you can give that to the companies you’re working with.” “Our biggest challenge with programmatic at the moment is the amount of invalid traffic that exists on the bidstream. You think you are bidding on real users and you are not. There is a lot of bots making the whole flow as if they were users” “Our objective is to be an alternative for app developers and to provide real value. We want to cut a little bit of the complexity of this market and build a platform where everything is as seamless as possible.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

We’re certain you’re experiencing this feeling as well - it’s as if we’re finally living in the world that was promised to us by science fiction movies. To be fair, AI has evolved into Artificial Intelligence that is indeed intelligent. While it lacks consciousness, the distinction between the two would be a topic for a separate conversation on another podcast. Today, I’ve invited Steve to assist app brands in understanding this complex landscape of Generative AI. Our goal is to empower you to make informed decisions about which AI tools to utilize, avoid common pitfalls, comprehend the skill sets your team requires, and more. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Steve Toy on LinkedInMemrise websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Steve Toy “You don’t really care about the performance metrics of all the different models out there. What matters is whether it can do the job you need it to do well and effectively.” “The biggest mistake is not understanding the job to be done. If you just bring tools into your system without a clear goal, you end up as the proverbial hammer wandering around looking for a nail.” “Expertise is actually less important in this world. What separates those who succeed with AI from those who don’t is perseverance — the willingness to go one more round” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

When it comes to growing app revenue, there’s no shortage of advice — but separating the shiny “growth hacks” from the strategies that actually move the needle is another story. In today’s crowded subscription app market, you can’t just set a price, launch, and hope for the best. You need to understand your users, their behaviors, and the subtle levers that can turn one-time downloads into long-term customers. In this episode, I’m joined by Jens to draw on his experience both inside a subscription app team and now supporting others, Jens shares practical, tested ways to increase revenue — from smarter pricing strategies to better handling of cancellations and reactivations. If you’re building, marketing, or monetizing an app, this conversation is packed with insights you can start applying right away, whether your goal is to capture more value from your most loyal users, adapt pricing for different markets, or simply stop leaving revenue on the table. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Jens-Fabian Goetzmann on LinkedInRevenueCat websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Jens-Fabian Goetzmann “The core offering should always come first. Value needs to be created before it is extracted—monetization works best when you’ve already built something that engages and retains users.” “Start experimenting with new customers first. They come in without preconceived notions, making it easier to test pricing, tiers, or new models without alienating your existing user base.” “Premature optimization is the biggest distraction. If your business model doesn’t work with the basics, you’re unlikely to fix it just by tweaking monetization tactics.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

OK, how many times do you hear on your team’s meetings “You need to be more creative!” Well, I have this question: “How can I be more creative with my app’s ad creatives?” Yes, today we’re featuring another App Talk interview that covers how creative drives app growth. It was taken by our Peggy Anne Salz with Megan Evans, Creative Director at ConsultMyApp during App Promotion Summit London 2025. In this interview, Megan talked about treating app creative as a specialized, data-driven discipline — not just design — means testing systematically, embracing what works (even if it’s off-brand), integrating across the user journey, and using AI to scale strategy, not just production. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Megan Evans on LinkedInConsultMyApp websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Megan Evans “Sometimes it’s the one you don’t want that wins, which is difficult for brands to understand.” “Don’t change too much at once — otherwise you’re never going to understand exactly what’s moving the needle.” “Instead of spending time on things that can be automated through AI, we’re now focusing on the parts that need the human brain.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

Welcome to the Business of Apps podcast! How is your summer so far? I hope you’re listening to this episode lying somewhere in a shadow on a beach, and with a breeze keeping you relaxed. I also hope that you are in a company of people you love to hang out with - be it your family or friends. Why? It’s because we all belong to a community, right? Yes - this is the moment when I’m tying in my intro with this week’s episode’s topic 😊 So here we go - today we’re featuring one of our latest App Talk interviews. This time, Peggy Anne Salz interviewed Kenzie Wilson, GTM Lead - AI Moderation at Stream - the platform that helps apps build real-time experiences that scale. Kenzie talks about why community is the key to app stickiness and how Stream’s APIs power real-time chat, feeds, video, and AI moderation for millions of users. You’ve heard it right - millions! Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Kenzie Wilson on LinkedInStream's websiteStrava appBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Kenzie Wilson “If you already have kind of that cult following of your app, and then you give them a place where they can actually talk to each other, your engagement is going to go through the roof.” “Every app is a community. You have users, you can have a community—and it’s actually pretty simple to do.” Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

In today’s crowded, AI-fueled landscape, it’s not enough to just have messaging — it has to stand out. In this episode, I’m joined by Jason from Customer.io to unpack what makes great mobile messaging work: from building frameworks rooted in value and differentiation, to using first-party data to deliver the right message at the right moment. We’ll talk strategy, execution, and the tools that help brands stay personal, timely, and unmistakably themselves — even at scale. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Jason Lyman on LinkedInCustomer.io websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Jason Lyman "Yeah, this is an interesting paradox that we've kind of created for ourselves. We have all these incredible tools like AI recommendations, powerful automation, sophisticated targeting, but everybody's using that playbook. And I think the result is customers are getting bombarded with messages that sounds very, very similar. so standing out needs to be less about being louder or frequent, and it needs to be focused around being more authentic." "So, first party data is absolutely the future, especially with privacy regulations that are tidying up across the globe. So here's what I see happening. think gold marketers are sitting on these gold mines of customer data, but they're not using it effectively. know, a lot of people are, are thinking about segmentation in a very traditional way." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

All right, I think all of you would agree—regardless of your role or area of expertise in this industry—that learning from the mistakes of others saves you time, money, and, most importantly, nerve cells. Because let’s be honest, trial and error is great… until it’s your budget on the line. So, today we have Reed on the show to help us skip some of those growing pains. He’s here to share what’s working, what’s not, and some fresh, thought-provoking approaches to both app marketing and development. Whether you’re scaling a product or just getting started, I think you’ll walk away with a few insights worth stealing—or at least borrowing. After founding the Business Strategy team at Branch six years ago, former strategy consultant Reed Kuhn has worked closely with hundreds of customers across verticals. Along the way, he’s picked up some sharp lessons—not just about best practices, but more importantly, about what not to do. In this episode, we’ll explore guiding objectives for app product owners and marketers, the greatest hits of killer use cases, mobile growth fails, and some simple ideas to make more from what you already have. Plus, we’ll look ahead with some bold predictions about how all of us will interact with apps in the AI-powered future. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Reed Kuhn on LinkedInGet in touch with the Branch.io teamBranch.io websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Reed Kuhn: "Over the years, so many of our customers fall into two big buckets. And this is, I think, the simplest framework that I have for differentiating between apps and what they're trying to achieve in terms of value. And that is you have commerce apps, which are the most obvious ones. This is your retailers, fashion, even quick serve restaurants, fast food chains, Starbucks, and also the big box retailers, the best buys of the world, even department stores like Nordstrom. Those are commerce apps. Users primarily are going in there to shop. And hopefully, they actually buy something. And we do know that conversion rates are much higher in apps than on mobile web or even desktop. So those are easy to wrap your head around. The app exists to make it much easier for the user to shop and, in some cases, actually get support. If you want to manage a delivery or send something back, you can do that in the app rather than having to call someone up. On the flip side, you have apps that don't really sell you anything, but they still serve a very important purpose to the user. So I call those companion apps and they're more diverse than commerce apps. So whereas commerce apps are very conversion focused, companion apps are much more feature focused. It's, I able to access information? So almost everybody is going to have their credit card or bank app on their phone, or at least they should be at this point. If they don't want to go there in person." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

If there is one feature that helps app marketers to persevere through so much of a market change, it is adaptability. As app user acquisition costs were rising and privacy constraints in mobile emerged, marketers came up with the solution - web to app user acquisition channel. Rather than sending users directly to an app store, marketers now route users to a mobile web page first—typically one optimized for onboarding, education, or even a light product experience. This allows for better control over messaging, tracking, and personalization before nudging users to install the app. In this episode, we’ll delve into the concept of web-first growth with Gessica, exploring the new playbook for acquiring app users. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Gessica Bicego on LinkedInBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Gessica Bicego "I would say there are two approaches. Like either you send them to a landing page, but ultimately they convert on an app store - so all the call-to-action will lead to the App Store, or Google Play store. Or you guide them through a web funnel, where you have like lots of questions and you end up purchasing on the web." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

What makes a mobile ad stick — and what makes it flop? In this special episode, we feature a panel discussion from App Promotion Summit London 2025, we hosted in April. Creative leaders explore next gen ad creative — the bold experiments, the unexpected successes, and the flops we can all learn from. From storytelling trends to performance-driven design, discover what’s working, what’s not, and where mobile advertising is heading next. 🎧 Tune in for fresh insights, practical takeaways, and real-world lessons from the frontlines of creative innovation. The panel of experts included: Yoann PavyAIApplyFreya FineKoru&FineMustafa MohamedShroomi AI

It’s been a couple of weeks since we wrapped up our App Promotion Summit London 2025. We were really happy to have so many bright, smart people under the same roof to share their knowledge and experience in app growth, app product development, ASO and so much more. We had several hundred folks from all corners of the world listening and learning from presentations and workshops, connecting with each other and do business. One of the highlights of the event was the “Beyond Installs: the future of app growth 2025” panel and in this episode we want to share it with you. The panel brought together people from four verticals - navigation, financials, e-Learning and gaming. This panel of experts included: Nidhi SinghAppsFlyerGreg Turtlewhat3wordsGiulia SalettoTideDiane GermannBlinkistYagiz OzyurekProduct Madness

The level of adoption of ChatGPT, the revolutionary LLM-based AI chatbot, is staggering. I think it wouldn’t be a stretch to say that by now ChatGPT and other similar AI chatbots are everywhere; people use them for work and leisure all the time. Sometimes, it feels like at some point generative AI chatbots will be joining team meetings not to take notes and summarize what was said but to report on what they did last week. OK, jokes aside - today we want to talk about the role of Generative AI in mobile ad creatives optimization. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Asaf Yanai on LinkedInAlison.ai websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Asaf Yanai "It changes everything from start to finish, or it could potentially change everything. It depends on the adoption. And I'll explain. I think that what happened in the past five to six years is a complete, complete change in the industry. However, if you look closely, you'll see that not all companies have changed. Not all companies have changed their operations or processes. The ones that adopted AI early on and those that adopted AI fully are a lot more advanced now. They're faster, they're quicker. They are spot on when it comes to strategy. And also the entire operation became a lot less heavy, heavy with costs, heavy with headcount, and heavy with processes and operations." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

One of the most important metrics for a mobile app is its conversion rate. It tells you how many people that use the app for free become your paying customers. It’s about how profitable and sustainable your app is. Now, if you are one of the die-hard Pink Floyd fans, you gotta love their song The Wall. If you are an app marketer, your wall is the paywall :-) Among many tools that you may use to increase the number of people who become your paying customers, once they hit the paywall, are cognitive biases. You may heard of them if you have a peripheral interest in psychology. Today, Max will tell you about using cognitive biases to significantly increase your app’s conversion rate. Today’s topics include: Links and Resources: Max Amelang on LinkedInPrematch websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Max Amelang "Yeah, it's absolutely a valid question because especially in the beginning, it's extremely tempting to see all of these tools you can use to somehow increase this conversion rate by margin or by another percent and so on. But then I also quickly realized not only as a product manager, but also as a user, how would I feel if I stumble across this? " "Obviously I know the tricks, so maybe I need to be a bit harder in order to define if something is good or not so good anymore. And I then came up with like, how would my parents behave on this paywall? Because parents just as a symbol for an older generation that are not as native with mobile apps. And I always am fascinated when I see how my dad navigates his app and when I realize, why did he just click on this button because it's blinking quicker? And I realized, okay, this is how easily he's influenced. So as a very soft first test, I'm thinking about, okay, how would my dad would behave on this paywall? Would he buy just because of the cognitive biases or would he still be able to make his own decision?" Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

Ok, here is the thing. Most apps are still built on rigid, one-size-fits-all user flows. They rely heavily on historic behavior - what a user clicked on last week or which segment they’re in. But user needs change moment to moment. And when apps fail to adapt, users just leave. The next evolution isn’t about personalizing based on identity - it’s about adapting based on intent. And that intent can only be accurately understood in context. In this episode, we’re going to talk about the Context Platform by ContextSDK that enables apps to detect real-world context in real time - whether a user is walking, relaxing, commuting, charging their phone, or simply on the move - and then infer their intent. Using a combination of on-device machine learning and server-side intelligence, the platform helps apps deliver the right experience or message at the right moment. This isn’t just a UX upgrade - it is a fundamentally better way to retain users and drive revenue, while respecting privacy and improving performance. Today’s Topics Include: Links and Resources: Dieter Rappold on LinkedInContextSDK websiteMaximizing app engagement through content-aware solutionsBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Dieter Rappold "It’s great to know a lot about past behavior, but past behavior is looking into the past. Intent is happening in the moment and is looking forward" "We collect enough data points on patterns of movement and behavior and analyze them with the smartest machine learning models out there. That allows us to infer intent—and that’s something extremely powerful when shaping app experiences," Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

I think by now you’ve noticed that the last few episodes weren’t regular ones, on those we featured our discussion panels from App Promotion Summit Berlin 2024. Why? Well, the physical space in the venue in Berlin was obviously limited and it’s not like you can fly to Berlin to visit the summit on a whim - time and money aren’t always there when you need them, right? But we don’t want you to miss an opportunity to listen to these discussions and learn from it. So here comes the next panel - “Beyond downloads: app engagement strategies" It was hosted by Keziah Husselbee, Product Marketing Specialist at Adobe. It was a pleasure to have on the panel people from: Jelena ZbijowskiBlinkistRoma ReyParshipMeet GroupRobert VaternamFreeleticsJon GenovardShareTheMeal

Good news - the winter is finally over, and I’m sure you’ve missed the warmth just as much as I have. Today, I’m thrilled to share with you another special episode featuring one of the discussion panels we hosted last December during the App Promotion Summit Berlin. This panel covers a wide range of topics, including user acquisition strategies, incrementality and ROI measurement, retargeting and re-engagement strategies, and more. The panel was hosted by Bob Hollanders, Head of Sales & Account Management, EMEA & US at Appier. We were fortunate to have on the panel: Victoria ChangWoogaPascal PrisoBabbelKarst KortekaasAppierCansu Bengü AğaoğluAdjust

Another week - another bonus episode for you. There is no other way to put it - data is the fuel that powers current economy. When we look at the mobile industry, we see that it is the absolutely essential part of the picture. You know it so well - acquiring app users was never easy but these days it is a real challenge. To win the game, you need to work out a data-driven strategy to acquire users for your app. On this episode, we feature “Data-driven strategies for UA” panel discussion we hosted during App Promotion Summit Berlin last December. The topics covered on the panel included user acquisition strategies, incrementality testing and attribution, branding and consistency, creative strategies for UA, creative fatigue, fake ads and transparency, playable ads, future plans for 2025, and more. This panel of experts includes: Ece StepienAppsFlyerJessica GottiPairedMatej JurcakPixel FederationMarta FogelNeuroNationKolibri Games All right, without any further ado…let’s go.

AI is reshaping the way brands create and test ads, and mobile marketing is at the forefront of this revolution. With AI-generated UGC (aka User Generated Content), creative testing at scale is no longer a challenge—it is an opportunity. Today, I’m joined by Andy to explore how their partnership with HeyGen is unlocking new possibilities for mobile advertisers. How is AI changing the game, and what does this mean for the future of creative? Let’s find out. Today’s Topics Include: Links and Resources: Andy Willers on LinkedInFavoured websiteHeyGen - AI video generatorBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Andy Willers " What AI has allowed us to do, particularly on the UGC side, is massively increase our capability for creative testing,” Andy said. “HeyGen’s digital avatars enable us to quickly generate multiple UGC scripts or executions—allowing us to test different messaging and ad styles at scale.." "We’re not at a stage where you type in a prompt and AI spits out a perfect execution. The human touch is still essential,” he explained. “HeyGen gives us the raw material—high-quality AI avatars—but it still requires skilled video editors to integrate them effectively with B-roll footage and visual elements." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

Today, we’re excited to feature a panel discussion we hosted at our App Promotion Summit Berlin last December. It focused on a crucial topic for all app marketers: User Acquisition in 2025. The panel covered a wide range of topics, including optimizing ad channels, the shift from attribution to incrementality, exploring new growth channels, and more. It was hosted by George Natsvlishvili, Co-Founder at We Up and the panelists were: Şebnem Alpaylı O'RourkeStillfront GroupAutoScout24Gaurav BhattacharyaZenjobAlper Taner

Today, we begin with another trivia question for you - can you think of the best case for A/B testing? Are you thinking about a particular app, service, or product? No - it’s bigger than that, I’m talking about the evolution of life on this planet. No, there is no a girl or a guy, sitting with a MacBook Pro and running A/B tests for all flora and fauna on this planet :-) My point is that testing is very fundamental and, if it will make you feel a bit more important, you’re doing it along with the Mother Nature. To talk about A/B testing for driving app growth we invited Tina. Today’s Topics Include: Links and Resources: Tina Kim on LinkedInHuckleberry Labs websiteBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Tina Kim " So A-B testing is really useful for when there is a shadow of doubt. Put it so whatever you A/B test, it's not some idea that you've picked from the air. It's always based off of some well-informed hypothesis, whether it be analyzing your behavioral data of your users or you've done some user research market research as well. There is always some well-informed hypothesis that drives you to build something." "The other thing is where A-B testing can really help you move forward faster is during the development process, the design process, there may be countless arguments about the perfect copy. Some people are very particular about copy, but and we may spend like endless cycles just trying to perfect the copy, but that's not the point of the change. Let's just test it. And A-B testing is iterative. And so you find something that you feel good with, it doesn't have to be perfect, and you test it and move forward. And if you feel like there's opportunity to squeeze more juice, test it again, right? And so I've been able to move forward faster." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012

In the future, history textbooks will be telling the story of how, at the beginning of the second decade of the 21st century, we all collectively jumped into the world of mobile apps. Now, you may be super excited about the growth of the mobile ecosystem or shake your head about its externalities, unintended consequences, but it’s undeniable - mobile apps take a huge spot in our lives. Today, a big chunk of the mobile app economy space belongs to app subscriptions - Netflix, Apple TV, Tinder, Duolingo, the list goes on and on. If you build apps yourself and monetize them with the subscription model, you will be really interested to learn about Phil’s Subscription Value Loop strategy. Today’s Topics Include: Links and Resources: Phil Carter on LinkedInPhil Carter's websiteMaven coursePhil's Sub stackBusiness Of Apps - connecting the app industry Quotes from Phil Carter: "The core of the subscription value loop framework that I teach about in my course is a company's core value promise. In other words, what is the value that you're providing to a user, and ideally to a paying subscriber, that is going to not just bring them to the product in the first place, but cause them to continue paying you a subscription over a long period of time?" "And value delivery is typically led by marketing teams, sometimes with the support of growth product teams or sales teams if you have a B2B business. And value delivery is all about making sure that you have sustainable unit economics, right? You're going to have some amount of LTV that you get from users. But in order to have a sustainable business, you need a strong LTV over CAC ratio and a rapid payback period. And that depends critically on your cost of user acquisition." Host Business Of Apps - connecting the app industry since 2012