The Unscripted SEO Interview Podcast

Will Wang of Black Belt Consulting joins Jeremy Rivera to discuss his journey from corporate IT analyst to accidentally building a seven-figure marketing agency. In this candid conversation, Will shares the expensive lessons he learned about hiring (including a $500,000 mistake), how he's leveraging AI for market research while keeping humans in the loop, and why he's betting big on YouTube and Instagram while going bearish on LinkedIn for 2025. This episode is packed with practical insights for agency owners, consultants, and entrepreneurs who are scaling their businesses and want to avoid the costly mistakes that come with rapid growth. Listen to the full episode: Unscripted SEO Podcast Guest Information Will Wang Black Belt Consulting@blackbeltconsultantWill Wangwill@blackbeltconsulting.co About Will: Will grew up in Sydney, Australia, worked in corporate IT making $130-150K/year before taking the leap into entrepreneurship. After two years of struggles and making every mistake possible, he built a seven-figure marketing agency which he sold 12 months ago. He's also a Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu black belt (earned 4 years ago) and now runs Black Belt Consulting, helping businesses scale from $25K to $250K per month with strategic marketing consulting. Key Topics & Timestamps The Corporate Escape The $500K Hiring Mistake Key lesson: Building Lean, AI-Enabled Teams SOPs and Systems for Non-Operations People AI for Market Research (Not Delivery) Content Strategy & Platform Bets for 2025

Jeremy Rivera interviews Kyle Bailey, founder of Front Burner Marketing, about local SEO strategies specifically designed for home service businesses. Kyle brings a unique perspective as one of the few SEO professionals who has actually worked in the trades—framing, roofing, drywall, and kitchen/bathroom remodeling. Kyle Bailey Front Burner MarketingWhat's Your Story? The Path to Connection with a Homeowner Connect with Kyle: FrontBurnerMarketing.net Key Topics Discussed The Unique Challenges of Home Service Marketing (02:00) Your Story as Your Superpower (04:00) Key Resource: What's Your Story? - Front Burner Marketing The Franchise Limitation (06:30) pizza franchise Community Co-Marketing: Driving Past Free Money (10:00) Related Article: Matt Brooks of SEOteric on nexus-based link building Example Businesses: Permacast WallsNewton Crouch Community Cleanups and Local Link Building (21:00) Community Clean Links The AI Search Reality (24:00) Your least trained but most popula...

Lisa Corwood, founder of Fuelled Agency, joins Jeremy to discuss how she transformed creative marketing experiments at a UK car dealership into a full-service agency philosophy. From the viral "Where's Wally" campaign that sparked it all to navigating Search Everywhere Optimization in 2026, this conversation covers authentic community engagement, why no industry is truly "boring," and the looming question of AI-generated content quality. Guest Lisa Corwood Founder, Fuelled Agency LinkedInInstagramYouTube Topics Covered (00:01)(00:18)(02:15)(04:13)(06:01)(07:05)(08:51)(10:59)(13:14)(15:06)(16:54)(18:44)(21:20)(23:24)(25:22)(27:57) Key Quotes "If you're going to go in there, don't just walk in a room and shout what you're saying and go out. Treat it as if it's a group of people—not a place to just spray and pray." "No matter what business it is—if it's selling a product, if it's shiny, if it's Lamborghinis or diamond rings—behind all of that is a team that makes that happen. Tell everybody about it!" "If you got 20 leads right now into your business, where would they go and what would happen with them? If you don't have an answer to that, there's something you need to look at." "Customers will hop from one platform to the other to get what they are looking for. They won't just take a five-star review as gospel." "I'm not against AI—but use it in collaboration, in conjunction. You can't solely rely on it." Resources & Links Mentioned Lisa's Agency & Socials Fuelled AgencyFuelled Agency ServicesCreators ClubLisa on LinkedInLisa on InstagramLisa on YouTube Industry Resources Search Everywhere Optimization Guide – Single GrainSearch Everywhere Optimization – Backli...

Guest: Tianna Mamalick, SMB Marketing School Episode Overview Tianna Mamalick shares her 12-year journey in SEO and why she's passionate about working with small businesses. With honest insights on managing client expectations, pairing SEO with paid ads, and the current state of AI-generated content, this conversation reveals what's actually working for service-based businesses right now. Key Discussion Points Why Small Businesses? For small businesses, a 10K monthly revenue increase is life-changing. Tianna shares how clients email her about hiring their first employee or taking their first vacation—results that go far beyond vanity metrics. Managing Expectations Brutally honest approach: clients sign for three months minimum, must have budget they can afford to lose, and receive realistic assessments of whether their business model fits the proven formula. SEO + Ads Strategy When done strategically, pairing ads with SEO helps prime new location pages and service pages through engagement, even though ads don't directly impact SEO rankings. The AI Content Reality After extensive testing: AI-generated content isn't ranking. Tianna's agency went 100% back to human-written content, using AI only for outlines based on top-ranking articles. Content Strategy Shifts service pages over blog posts AI Search Adoption Despite the hype, less than 10% of traffic comes from ChatGPT for most small businesses. Prepare by enriching About pages and author bios, but don't panic about immediate massive shifts. Resources Mentioned Andy CrestodinaContent ChemistrySEOtericGet Me LinksGus Pelogia interviewMichael McDougald, Right Thing AgencyPrecast Walls Best Quote "People want to work with people they like, know and trust. It's not just about the backlink. We're really looking at conversions—how can we get SEO to convert for you?" — Tianna Mamalick Connect with Tianna smbmarketingschool.com@smbmarketingschoolFunnel Summit Key Takeaways ✓ Service pages first: Make product and service pages comprehensive before worrying about blog content ✓ Human content wins: AI-generated articles aren't ranking—use AI for outlines, humans for writing ✓ Record everything: Mine sales calls, customer support logs, and front-line staff conversations for gold ✓ Every service gets a page: Stop using men...

In this episode of the Unscripted SEO Podcast, Jeremy Rivera sits down with Matt Bailey, a digital marketing veteran with nearly 30 years of experience spanning from the pre-Google AltaVista era to today's AI-driven landscape. Matt shares his journey from building real estate websites with journalism principles in 1995 to founding SiteLogic and helping shape the SEO industry through his work with the OMCP (Online Marketing Certified Professional Organization). This conversation explores the evergreen principles that have survived every "SEO is dead" cycle, the critical gaps in SEO education, and why AI is both a productivity tool and a source of strategic confusion for businesses. Matt and Jeremy discuss the importance of conversion optimization, the holistic webmaster approach that got lost in the 2010-2020 era of easy Google traffic, and why understanding content, context, and community remains fundamental to digital marketing success. Key Topics Covered: social traffic behavior differs dramatically Guest Matt Bailey sitelogic.comlearn.sitelogic.comlinkedin.com/in/mattbaileysitelogic Extended Recap The Origin Story: From Journalism to Pre-Google SEO Matt Bailey's journey into digital marketing began in an unexpected place—journalism school. While he quickly realized journalism wasn't his calling, the education gave him something invaluable: an understanding of how to lay out content for quick consumption. Headlines, subheadings, bullet points—these newspaper design principles became the foundation of his website development approach in 1995-96. Working in real estate at the time, Matt started building websites as electronic versions of printed pages. What he didn't realize initially was that the markup he was using for visual layout was exactly what early search engines needed. This was the AltaVista era, where SEOs would spend entire nights resubmitting pages to chase rankings. When Google arrived, Matt's content-first approach paid immediate dividends. Pages structured with clear hierarchy and reader-focused design performed well naturally. This early lesson—that optimizing for visitors and optimizing for search engines aren't separate goals—would become a through-line in his entire career. The Analytics Awakening A pivotal moment came when Matt was working on real estate websites and asked himself: "What can I do on the website that will have the biggest impact?" He didn't have an answer. That question forced him to learn analytics, starting with Web Trends (anyone who's worked...

Josh Squires is an Associate Director of SEO at Amsive with 17 years of experience spanning freelance, in-house, agency, and consultancy work. He helped launch the SEO practice at Tableau and has worked extensively across DTC, e-commerce, Shopify, and SaaS sectors. Connect with Josh: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshsquiresrva/ Key Takeaways Communication is SEO's Hidden Superpower - The most effective SEOs function like UN diplomats, translating technical requirements into language that resonates with developers, executives, and stakeholders. Without implementation, even the smartest SEO strategy means nothing. Content Volume is Dead, Strategic Relevance is King - Google is actively rejecting low-quality blog content that doesn't serve user intent. The winning strategy focuses on middle and bottom-funnel content that directly supports conversions, including brand comparisons and product use cases that audiences are already searching for in LLMs. Systems Thinking Separates Good SEOs from Great Ones - Modern SEO requires understanding how search engines, LLMs, social platforms, and email systems interconnect. Success comes from pulling levers that create ripple effects across multiple channels, not just optimizing for a single platform. Entity Building Requires Multi-Channel Brand Investment - Establishing a recognized entity goes far beyond on-page optimization. It demands consistent NAP data across directories, strategic backlink building from industry publications, social proof in relevant communities, and yes—actual ad spend and PR investment to get people talking about your brand. Killer Quotes "I think the most effective SEOs could probably just leave work and go work at the UN. Your job requires you to be part translator, part diplomat." "You could be the smartest, most innovative SEO, but if you can't get any of it implemented, none of it means anything." "Google is ceasing to rank these pages, ceasing to index them in some cases we've seen, Google just doesn't want your junk traffic anymore." "Now is the time for SEOs who are systems thinkers to really shine. If you are a systems thinker, you're acknowledging other channels, but you're also acknowledging technological states, you're acknowledging how NLPs work." "We gotta stop being so self-reliant and think more outside the box and give other channels their credit. Because that's where you're gonna see the amplitude." "I have been saying for years, the teams that report to me are, I know, so sick of hearing me say this. The best advice to clients is be a brand." "There's always value in visibility. Coca-Cola wouldn't spend the insane amount of money it costs to paint those trucks if there wasn't value in visibility." Episode Highlights The Many Faces of SEO: Different Contexts, Different Challenges Josh breaks down his experiences across freelance, in-house, agency, and consultancy work, explaining why consultancy offers the cleanest separation between strategy and implementation, while in-house roles often require the broadest technical skillset. Communication: The Underappreciated SEO Skill Young SEOs often struggle with tailoring communication to different audiences. Developers need precise technical specifications, executives need business outcomes, and designers need creative direction—all from the same SEO initiative. Local SEO: Finding the Right Level of Specificity Hyper-local content works—when done right. Josh explains when to target neighborhoods versus cities, using search volume and user intent as guides. The key...

In this episode of the Unscripted SEO Podcast, host Jeremy Rivera and Jonathan Schüßler delve into the intricacies of SEO, discussing the evolution of the industry, the impact of AI, and the importance of niche marketing. Jonathan shares his journey from wedding photography to SEO, highlighting the challenges and strategies in local and international SEO. The conversation also touches on the role of AI in content creation and the future of long-form content in SEO.

Summary In this episode, Keith Breseé interviews David Bell, CEO of USA Mobile Drug Testing, who shares his extensive experience in SEO and digital marketing, particularly in the drug testing industry. David discusses the journey of rebuilding his website after being penalized by Google, the strategies that led to significant traffic growth, and the importance of engaging franchisees in content creation. He emphasizes the need for relevant and fresh content, the role of AI in SEO, and the significance of link building. The conversation concludes with insights on trust in business relationships and the importance of understanding customer motivations. Takeaways

In this episode, Jeremy Rivera sits down with Adrian Dahlin, founder of Search to Sale, to explore the intersection of traditional SEO principles and emerging AI technologies. Adrian brings a unique perspective as someone relatively new to SEO—having focused on it for just over three years—combined with a master's degree in applied data science and a background in creative marketing. The conversation tackles the evolving landscape of search, from Google's helpful content update to the rise of generative engine optimization (GEO). Adrian shares candid insights about the challenges of selling SEO during a period of industry uncertainty, how reframing services around AI unlocked new client conversations, and why the convergence of SEO, digital PR, and Reddit marketing is creating powerful feedback loops for brands. Key themes include the timeless nature of authentic storytelling (drawing on Simon Sinek's "Start With Why"), the shift from top-of-funnel content to bottom-of-funnel solutions, and Adrian's compelling analogy of AI as "a consultant working for your customer" rather than just another marketing channel. The discussion also explores the darker implications of writing for robots to write for humans, the dilution of authority online, and the challenges of vetting information in an age of AI-generated content. Key Takeaways On Fresh Perspectives in SEO Adrian: "Trust me because I am relatively new to it and so what's normal to me is what's current and I'm not stuck doing it a version from 10 years ago." Jeremy: "Dinosaurs like me have a lot of baggage. It's interesting because for me, the more that it changes, the more it stays the same." Adrian: "I think I agree that the principles stay the same, but tactics kind of change." On the Art and Science of SEO Adrian: "I am a marketer with a data science background. I got a master's degree in applied data science, but I also really love like flushing out key messaging and like developing a voice and a brand... I love words and numbers and SEO is all about using data to help guide creative content projects." Jeremy: "I have always seen SEO as part science, part art. There is definitely a heavy data sciences aspect to it... but also, you know, the artistic capability to understand the flaws in the data and understand the incredible multi-layer, multi-tiered black box that we're playing with for organic results." On Authentic Marketing and Storytelling Adrian: "I'll start with Simon Sinek. So his TED Talk, Start With Why, was one of the very first things that started to form how I thought about marketing... people don't buy what you do, they buy why you d...

Navigating Multi-Channel Marketing in the Age of LLMs with Claude Zdanow and Chris Becker Episode Overview: The golden age of Google-only SEO is over. In this revealing conversation, Jeremy Rivera sits down with Claude Zdanow (CEO) and Chris Becker (President) of Onar—a publicly traded marketing technology and agency network—to explore how businesses must fundamentally reimagine their digital marketing strategies. From tracking brand visibility in LLM responses to measuring "share of wallet" in ChatGPT, this episode tackles the measurement crisis facing every CMO today. You'll discover why traffic is down but revenue is up for many brands, how to use AI agents to track your competitive position in AI search, and why meeting customers "knee to knee" in real life is more important than ever. If you're still optimizing for traffic and rankings, this episode will challenge everything you thought you knew about digital marketing success. Key Topics Covered: Guest Information: Claude Zdanow - CEO, Onar Onar Chris Becker - President, Onar About Onar:

In this episode of Unscripted SEO, host Jeremy Rivera sits down with Erica D'Arcangelo, CEO of Love Content Development, to discuss the evolution of digital marketing agencies, the hybrid work model, and navigating the AI revolution in content creation. About Our Guest Erica D'Arcangelo is the CEO of Love Content Development, a full-service marketing agency with 14 years in business. She also owns Create One (video production company) and V12 Strategies (marketing technology company). Over her career, Erica has worked with approximately 800 companies and generated nearly $300 million across all marketing contracts. She's also an Amazon bestselling author of "A Story About Pizza," chronicling her grandfather's journey as an Italian immigrant opening a pizzeria in 1960. Key Topics Discussed From Employee to Entrepreneur healthcare marketingHTML codingown agency Scaling an Agency Client retention The Hybrid Work Model The Death and Rebirth of SEO Foundational SEO in a Multi...

Guest: Lorraine Ball, Host of More Than a Few Words Podcast Experience: 19 years running a digital marketing agency, sold in 2021 Current Focus: Marketing consulting, teaching, and podcasting Key Topics Covered Building and Scaling an Agency Business Philosophy Strategic Insights Episode 2: Lorrie Thomas Ross - Marketing in the AI Era Guest: Lorrie Thomas Ross, CEO of Web Marketing Therapy Title: "The Marketing Therapist" Experience: 19 years as Chief Enthusiasm Officer, former UC Santa Barbara & UC Berkeley instructor Key Frameworks Discussed The Five Factor Framework CredibilityUsabilityVisibilitysearch and social mediaSellabilityScalability "MarkEDing" Philosophy...

In this episode of the Unscripted SEO podcast, host Jeremy Rivera interviews Katie Wagner, President & CEO of KWSM Digital Marketing Agency. They dive deep into the evolution of SEO, the importance of brand journalism, and how businesses can adapt to the changing digital landscape including AI overviews and LLM-based search. Guest Information Katie Wagner Connect with Katie: kwsmdigital.com Host Information Jeremy Rivera Connect with Jeremy: Jeremy Rivera BioUnscripted SEO Key Topics Discussed 1. The Evolution of SEO 2. Brand Journalism Strategy 3. Revenue-Focused Marketing

Host: Jeremy Rivera Guest: Virginia Elder, Owner of Podcast Abundance Topic: The evolution of SEO, podcast marketing strategy, and cross-channel content creation Episode Description In this in-depth conversation, Jeremy Rivera sits down with Virginia Elder, owner of Podcast Abundance, to explore how podcasting fits into modern SEO and content marketing strategies. They discuss the evolution from traditional website-focused SEO to a holistic, cross-channel approach that leverages podcasting, social media, and authentic human connections to build brand authority and drive business growth. Virginia shares her journey from financial audit work to becoming a podcast production specialist for financial professionals, while Jeremy explains why genuine human conversations can't be replicated by AI and how podcasting creates valuable content ecosystems for businesses. Key Topics Discussed The Evolution of SEO Strategy Cross-Channel Marketing Approach Entity Recognition and Personal Branding Podcast Production for Business Growth

Episode: Unscripted SEO Podcast Host: Jeremy Rivera - Unscripted Podcast Guest: Chris Turnbull, Founder of Catalyst Marketing Duration: ~45 minutes Episode Description Join Jeremy Rivera as he sits down with Chris Turnbull, founder of Catalyst Marketing, for an unfiltered discussion about how SEO has evolved over the past 13 years. From Google's monopolistic behavior to the rise of AI overviews, this conversation explores why local SEO has remained surprisingly stable while broader search continues to fragment across multiple platforms. Chris shares insights from his journey from apprentice SEO to agency founder, specializing in performance marketing for local service businesses. The duo dives deep into the breakdown of traditional content marketing, the rise of user-generated content, and why Reddit posts now carry the same weight as backlinks from 2015. Key Topics Covered The Google Monopoly & Search Evolution Local SEO: What's Changed vs. What Hasn't local SEO fundamentalsDigital PR The Content Creation Paradox create content for humansalgorithm updates

Unscripted SEO Show Notes: Entity Optimization with Jason Barnard Episode Overview Jeremy Rivera interviews Jason Barnard of KaliCube about entity optimization, AI assistive engines, and the future of search. This conversation explores practical strategies for controlling your digital footprint and optimizing for modern search systems. Explore the COMPLETE Episode, and read the deep dive on SEO Arcade for further topical exploration in the same field of entities, Ai and SEO. Guest Bio: Jason Barnard Jason Barnard is the founder of Cali Cube and a pioneer in entity optimization. He started in 1998 with a children's website that grew to one billion page views in 2007, competing with BBC and PBS. In 2012, he successfully changed Google's perception of him from "cartoon blue dog" to "respected entrepreneur and digital marketer" - becoming one of the first to master entity transformation. Related Episodes You'll Love ️ Similar Deep Dives: If you enjoyed this conversation about entities and AI, check out our interview with Mark Williams Cook on technical SEO innovations where we explored how machine learning is reshaping technical optimization strategies. ️ Foundational Concepts: For more on search evolution and brand building, don't miss our conversation with Rand Fishkin on the future of SEO. Rand's perspective on sustainable organic growth strategies pairs perfectly with Jason's entity optimization methodology. Key Takeaways The Algorithmic Trinity:LLM chatbotsEntity Optimization Timeline:Industry-Specific Authority Matters:The Claim-Frame-Prove Method:

Guest Information Daniel Horowitz Senior SEO Manager at Informatica Connect: LinkedIn Episode Summary Daniel Horowitz shares his decade-long journey in SEO, from agency-side link building campaigns to managing enterprise SEO at Informatica. We dive deep into the impact of Google's Helpful Content Update, the shift from traffic-focused to conversion-focused strategies, and practical tactics that still work in the AI-dominated search landscape. Key Takeaways Episode Timestamps [00:01] - Introductions and Daniel's background at Informatica [00:42] - Link building experiences with Shopify Exchange project [02:09] - Evolution from link building to enterprise SEO strategies [03:39] - Digital PR vs traditional link building approaches [07:02] - Google's maker sessions and the "answer engine" revelation [08:13] - The Helpful Content Update's devastating impact on travel blogging [09:03] - Enterprise SEO evangelism and cross-functional collaboration [11:50] - Subject Matter Expert (SME) interview series strategy [15:05] - Moving beyond basic keyword-focused content [15:48] - Transitioning from blogs to resource pages and use cases [19:00] - Justifying content marketing spend with declining traffic [21:39] - Cross-channel marketing and sentiment analysis [25:28] - Platform diversification beyond Google [29:54] - The future of SEO in an AI-dominated world [37:13] - Actionable advice: The power of internal linking Topics Discussed Link Building Evolution Enterprise SEO Strategy

Summary In this UnscriptedSEO conversation, Jeremy Rivera and LinkedIn expert Daniel Alfon discuss the often-overlooked potential of LinkedIn as a powerful SEO tool. They explore the evolution of social media, the importance of authority and identity on LinkedIn, and strategies for targeting the right audience. The discussion also covers the nuances of B2B versus B2C marketing, optimizing LinkedIn profiles, the significance of recommendations, and the differences between posting articles and posts. Alfon emphasizes the importance of understanding user behavior on LinkedIn and how to convert connections into meaningful business relationships. Takeaways

Summary In this episode of the Unscripted SEO podcast, Keith Breseé hosts Paritosh Pareek and Anthony Prichard from WP Sprints to discuss the critical aspects of SEO, particularly focusing on technical SEO and video strategies for local businesses. They explore the importance of optimizing video content for search engines, common mistakes made in WordPress SEO, and the role of AI in content creation. The conversation emphasizes the need for businesses to adapt to changing SEO landscapes and leverage video as a powerful tool for building trust and visibility online. Takeaways

Host: Jeremy Rivera - Founder, SEO Arcade Guest: Melissa Popp - Founder, Rickety Roo | @poppupwriter Episode Length: 60 minutes Episode Overview In this deep-dive conversation, Jeremy Rivera and Melissa Popp explore the seismic shifts happening in SEO and digital marketing. From AI overviews decimating organic click-through rates to the fundamental question of whether SEO as we know it still exists, this episode tackles the industry's biggest challenges and opportunities. Key Discussion Points: Best Quotes from This Episode "We should be more in the ecosystem... our value could be so much more than Google. Why are we tying ourselves to Google?" - Melissa Popp "From 2010 to 2021 SEO was merely reverse engineering Google. That was it. That was our job. We can't ignore other methods or other ways that search occurs." - Jeremy Rivera "Chat GPT is now your most popular and least knowledgeable customer representative." - Referenced insight from Mike Buckby "I question whether we actually see the death of the top of the funnel... we relied so much on top of the funnel to drive people in and guide them to the right place on our websites." - Melissa Popp Key Takeaways & Action Items ✅ For SEO Professionals Expand beyond Google optimizationLearn automation toolsShift metrics focusTest LLM strategies