Ways to Change the World with Krishnan Guru-Murthy

Artificial intelligence is evolving faster than ever - and the debate over AI safety, regulation, and control is intensifying. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Jack Clark, co-founder and Head of Policy at Anthropic, the company behind the Claude AI systems. A former journalist turned AI insider, Clark has been at the centre of some of the biggest debates shaping the future of this technology - from safety and regulation to the race between innovation and control. They discuss Clark’s journey from reporting on AI to building it, his decision to leave OpenAI over concerns about safety, and the growing fear that powerful systems are outpacing our ability to manage them. From warning governments at the UN to grappling with the risks as a father, Clark reflects on the tension at the heart of his work: what does it mean to build something you believe could be dangerous?

Prue Leith may be best known as a judge on The Great British Bake Off, but her influence reaches far beyond television. She founded a leading cookery school, built a Michelin-starred restaurant, spent decades shaping national policy on food education and public health, and has written extensively on ageing. This year she also served as a judge for The British Book Awards. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, she speaks to Krishnan Guru-Murthy, reflecting on her latest new book ‘Being Old… and Learning to Love It!’ and talks frankly about growing older, staying relevant, finding happiness, and why she believes ageing can be liberating. Prue also discusses childhood nutrition, school food, her campaigns with Jamie Oliver, weight-loss injections, why she refuses to exercise, and the realities of caring for a parent with dementia. This conversation includes discussion around suicide.

Amanda Knox became internationally known following the 2007 murder of Meredith Kercher in Pereugia, Italy, and the years of legal proceedings and media scrutiny that followed. Knox was found guilty of Meredith’s murder in 2009 but was ultimately acquitted in 2015. She has since written and spoken extensively about her experience, and has advocated for others who may have been falsely imprisoned. Her latest documentary, Mouth of the Wolf, sees her return to Perugia, where she spent four years in prison - and confront Giuliano Mignini, the prosecutor who sent her to prison more than 15 years ago. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Knox about accountability in the justice system, the importance of admitting when institutions get it wrong, and the lasting stigma that follows even after innocence is proven.

Heston Blumenthal is one of the world’s most innovative chefs, known for transforming the way we think about food, flavour and the dining experience. From his self-taught beginnings to building one of the most celebrated restaurants in the world, his career has been defined by curiosity, experimentation and a refusal to follow convention. But beyond the kitchen, Blumenthal has also been navigating deeply personal mental health challenges that almost led him to death at one point. In 2023, his wife Melanie Ceysson had him sectioned under the Mental Health Act following a severe manic episode and bipolar diagnosis. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Heston Blumenthal about his approach to mindful and sustainable eating, living with ADHD and bipolar disorder, and why he is determined to challenge stigma.

My guest this week is Eric Schlosser, the investigative journalist and author whose work has fundamentally changed how we think about what we eat. Fast Food Nation was a landmark book that exposed the abuse of animals and the exploitation of workers at the heart of America's food industry. Now, 25 years after it was first published, Schlosser says he is astonished that not only has the industry failed to improve, in many ways it has gotten worse. And yet, despite this, he still believes change is possible.

Warning: moderate strong language Ece Temelkaran is an award-winning journalist and novelist who has spent years warning that the collapse of democracy rarely announces itself with a bang. Instead, it happens gradually - institution is weaken, truth is eroded and what once felt unthinkable becomes normal. Ece knows this first hand. After being fired from her newspaper in Turkey amid mounting political pressure, she watched her country slide towards what she says is authoritarianism, a story she believes is no longer uniquely Turkish but part of a wider global pattern. In her writing, she argues that the real danger isn't just strong men or populist leaders, but how easily societies adapt to them. Her latest book, Nation of Strangers, explores belonging and exile. But beneath it lies the same urgent question that has defined much of her work. How do democracies fail? And can they still be saved? On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Ece about democratic backsliding, the moral crisis she believes sits at the heart of modern politics, the experience of exile, and why rebuilding democracy may require not just political change, but a deeper transformation in how we see ourselves and each other. This interview was recorded on 13 February 2026.

Katharine Viner has spent the past decade running one of the most influential news organisations in the world, steering it through profound industry change, digital upheaval and intense political pressure. She became the first woman to lead The Guardian in its 205-year history. Under her editorship the paper has transformed its funding model, expanded globally, and fought to preserve the idea of independent public interest journalism at a time when trust in the media is under sustained strain. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Katharine about defending liberal values in a polarised age, navigating internal editorial battles during turbulent political moments, and why The Guardian sees itself as a global mainstream newsroom.

“It's really a deep irony that this guy who has really never set foot in a normal American street was mistaken as a man of the people”, writer George Saunders says of the US President, Donald Trump. His work has long centred on the very people who live with the consequences of decisions made far above them, ordinary and fallible individuals navigating increasingly hostile conditions. In a world marked by political lies, climate denial and the erosion of shared reality, Saunders’ fiction interrogates moral ambiguity, human weakness and the forces that draw individuals toward destructive choices. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Saunders about the collapse of truth in public life, why satire no longer pierces political leaders who feel no shame, and whether storytelling can still help us understand one another in an age of polarisation.

Clara Mattei is an economist who wants us to rethink the idea that capitalism is simply the natural order of things. She is an author and professor of economics whose work explores how economic ideas become tools of power, shaping policy while masking the political decisions beneath. Her new book, Escape from Capitalism, argues that many of the problems that we see as inevitable - poverty, unemployment, inflation - are built into the system and shored up by models and theories designed to convince us that there is no alternative. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Mattei about whether there is an alternative to capitalism.

For decades veteran Singaporean diplomat Kishore Mahbubani has challenged what he sees as Western complacency, warned of the irreversible rise of Asia, and argued that the global order must adapt to a world no longer dominated by Europe and the United States. And now it appears Western leaders have caught up with him as a new world order is declared in the wake of the “rupture”, as Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney called it, of President Trump’s second term. Born into poverty in Singapore, he rose through the country’s foreign service to become its ambassador to the United Nations and then president of the UN security council. He joined Krishnan Guru-Murthy on this episode of Ways to Change the World.

Mehdi Hasan is a prominent broadcast journalist in America who’s forthright anti-Trump and pro-Palestinian opinions have thrust him to the fore of many of the big issues facing the country today. He is the founder and editor-in-chief of Zeteo, previously hosting The Mehdi Hasan Show on MSNBC, and his work straddles the line between conventional journalism and advocacy-driven argument. In this episode of Ways to Change the World he tells Krishnan Guru-Murthy why he believes American democracy is facing an “existential threat’, what he expects to happen next in Gaza and whether Labour can withstand the rise of Nigel Farage’s Reform UK. In the podcast, Mehdi makes accusations against several US companies. Comcast rejects any suggestions it may have engaged in misconduct by donating to the new $400 million ballroom under construction at the Trump White House. Responding to Sen. Elizabeth Warren, who asked the media and Internet company if there had been a quid pro quo, they said: “Comcast’s pledged donation included no specific limitations or conditions on how the proceeds were to be used or spent. Furthermore, Comcast made the donation with no expectations of receiving anything in return and the implication that the donation has anything to do with a potential transaction involving Warner Brothers Discovery is categorically false.” When Paramount settled their lawsuit with President Trump they said the money was going to be allocated to Trump's future presidential library, not paid to him "directly or indirectly". The company also noted the settlement does not include a statement of apology or regret. Responding to reports in the Financial Times that a donor to Donald Trump’s reelection campaign had received the first barrels of oil obtained from Venezuela after America seized president Maduro, a White House spokesman said: “President Trump always does what is in the best interest of the American people, such as brokering this historic energy deal with Venezuela immediately following the arrest of narcoterrorist Nicolás Maduro. The media’s continued attempts to fabricate conflicts of interest are a tired attempt to distract from the incredible work only this president is capable of achieving.” The White House has also rejected accusations of corruption. Israel denies accusations of genocide and ethnic cleansing.

Nick Lowles has spent three decades fighting racism and extremism and in 2004 founded the advocacy group Hope Not Hate which became instrumental in defeating the far-right British National Party. Under his leadership, Hope Not Hate has become a leading voice in the UK against hate groups and far-right extremism, while Nick himself has become the target of countless threats. His new book, How to defeat the far right: lessons from Hope Not Hate, tells the story of how intolerance and hate have grown in western societies and what can be done to counter them.

Rebecca Kuang is the bestselling novelist whose books explore some of the most fraught debates of our time, interrogating racism in publishing, cultural appropriation, tokenism and diversity politics. Her novel Yellowface in particular struck a nerve, highlighting the pressures and hypocrisies of the modern literary world, from social media mobbing and cancel culture to the uncomfortable questions about who gets to tell which stories. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, she speaks to Krishnan Guru-Murthy why America’s higher education is broken and why AI is not a threat to literature.

Chris McCausland is perhaps now best known as the first blind contestant on Strictly Come Dancing and the show's 2024 champion. His famous waltz with dancer Diane Buswell even won a Bafta as the most memorable moment in TV. He first started losing sight as a young boy due to a genetic condition, and was fully blind in his early twenties. But he has never let disability define him. In his latest autobiography, Keep Laughing, Chris details the journey of a boy from Liverpool who goes on to win the hearts of the nation. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, he talks to Krishnan Guru-Murthy about why it was important for him to take part in Strictly Come Dancing, the frustrations and identity challenges he faced as he grappled with losing sight, and how he continues to challenge perceptions.

Sanna Marin became Finland’s prime minister at just 34 - the youngest serving national leader at the time. She was raised by her mother and her mother’s female partner in modest circumstances, and was the first in her family to complete high school and attend university. Since her rise to power, Marin has become known for her outspoken commitment to climate action, social justice and democratic values. In her memoir Hope in Action, Marin shares a journey marked by resilience and hope, as well as a vision for a new kind of leadership. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Marin speaks to Krishnan Guru-Murthy about the European leadership, why she left politics and how to embrace womanhood.

Cory Doctorow has spent decades helping to shape the way we think about the modern internet. He is a campaigner against monopolies, against surveillance and against digital rights. His new book Enshitification: Why Everything Suddenly Got Worse and What to Do About It analyses how the internet giants have captured us and become not quite as good as we had thought they were. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Cory about the broken systems we are living in and what we can do to try and make things better. Strong language warning.

Jan Ravens is one of the UK’s most celebrated impressionists and comedians. She first discovered comedy at Cambridge University’s Footlights society, where she made history as the first female president. Now she is best known for her work on the hit BBC show Dead Ringers, where her impressions of figures like Theresa May, Liz Truss, Margaret Thatcher and others have become iconic. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Jan about the meaning of satire and the importance of a good laugh.

Ben Cohen, co-founder of Ben & Jerry’s, is calling on Unilever to “free” the ice cream brand after years of clashes over its social mission and stance on issues like Gaza. In this episode of Ways to Change the World, Ben tells Krishnan Guru-Murthy why he believes business has become the strongest force in society - and why it must care about more than profit. Unilever maintains that it’s working to create “a fairer, more socially inclusive world”.

David Shrigley is one of Britain’s most original and celebrated contemporary artists. Known for his deadpan drawings, iconic sculptures and ambitious installations, David Shrigley’s work blends absurd humour with sharp observations on everyday life. On this episode of Ways to Change the World, Krishnan Guru-Murthy joins David at his latest show, Exhibition of Old Rope, in central London to discuss art, politics and Donald Trump.

Founding member of Pussy Riot and one of the most high-profile political activists in Russia imprisoned by Vladimir Putin's government - in this Ways to Change the World Podcast, Krishnan Guru-Murthy speaks to Masha Alyokina. She became internationally known after the group's protest performance in Moscow's Cathedral of Christ the Saviour in 2012, which led to her arrest and two years in prison. Since her release, Masha has continued to challenge Putin's regime and fight for freedom of expression through her art, writing and activism. And her new book, Political Girl, is an account of protest, prison and her thoughts about Russia today.