The Art of Range

Gabe Brown was thinking about and practicing regenerative grazing before it had a name. Grazing management that maintains the productive potential of naturally occurring ecosystems is an ecological imperative that is as needful today as it was 10,000 years ago. In this conversation between Gabe and Tip, they land on definitions for regenerative grazing, discuss problems with the term 'sustainable agriculture', and speculate on future directions for ecological agriculturalists. And Gabe answers a question he's never been asked before. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-166-gabe-brown-regenerative-grazing for the transcript and links to resources mentioned in the episode.

How does barbed wire affect wildlife? Is there a better way to manage livestock location that distributes grazing effects and cares for the other animals occupying these landscapes? Maybe this is not a new idea? Jay Kehne with Conservation Northwest believes virtual fence is one of the answers. CNW facilitated and funded implementation of a virtual fence system for numerous ranchers affected by a large wildfire in 2020-21 that burned nearly half a million acres of sage grouse habitat in the Pacific Northwest. He's learned a thing or two about virtual fence and shares much of that in this interview. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-165-virtual-fence-benefits-wildlife-jay-kehne-conservation-northwest for links to resources mentioned in this interview and a full transcript.

The King Ranch is considered "The Birthplace of American Ranching". On its 150th birthday, King Ranch partnered with Texas A&M Kingsville to establish a masters program in ranch management, the only one of its kind. Rick Machen is the executive director of this program and speaks to the efficacy and reach of the Institute, still in its first quarter-century. Rick and Tip discuss why ranching well matters more than ever, why training future ranchers is critical, and how the King Ranch Institute for Ranch Management functions to serve these Texas-sized goals. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission. Go to the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-164-king-ranch-institute-ranch-management-rick-machen for links to resources mentioned in this episode as well as the full transcript of the conversation.

Andrew Coppin is the co-founder and CEO of RanchBot, a company aiming to reduce the cost and stress of managing stockwatering supplies in the large percentage of the world's surface where water really matters to grazing operations of all sizes. But as a former investment banker in corporate finance, Andrew has broader socioecological goals: "Ranchers are the largest custodians of natural capital on the planet outside of governments, and 98% of ranchers I know are trying to respect the land and work in sympathy with nature, and they're trying to leave the planet better than they found it for their children and their children's children. This is embedded in most ranchers' raison d'etre--RanchBot can help ranchers verify natural capital, to gather data that demonstrates stewardship." The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Go to the episode page for a full transcript and links to resources mentioned in this interview: https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-163-stockwater-monitoring-technologies-and-natural-capital-andrew-coppin-ranchbot

The Montana Grazing Lands Coalition 2025 Grazing Expo is an event designed to empower land managers with tangible resources while highlighting the West-wide impact of sound grazing lands stewardship. In this interview with Megan Terry, executive director for the Montana Grazing Lands Coalition, we discuss the importance of rancher peer-to-peer learning, integrated face-to-face grazing management education, and why people should attend the 2025 Grazing Expo in Billings September 4-7 and get involved with their state's or region's Grazing Lands Coalition. Listen to Megan's story about becoming an advocate for active management of wild rangelands. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-162-grazing-lands-expo-2025-megan-terry for a full transcript of this interview and links to resources mentioned in this episode.

What would rural finance look like if it truly supported long-term stewardship and resilience? This is the question Zach Ducheneaux has been asking himself and working toward for a couple of decades. Zach is an agricultural producer, a farming advocate, and the former Administrator of the USDA Farm Service Agency. From experiencing firsthand ag lending dysfunction in the 1980s farm crisis, to witnessing local community relationships in action that resulted in local lending based on trust, to helping USDA design lending programs that promote young farmers and ranchers, Zach understands ag lending like few others. In this interview he introduces principles that promote long-term capital reinvestment and producer-centered terms. This is good for borrower and lender. And it builds social capital, something badly needed in a modern economy. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Go to the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-161-5th-c-agricultural-lending-zach-ducheneaux for more information or to contact Zach.

Dan Dagget was one of the original members of EarthFirst!, one of the more radical environmental activist organizations of the last 50 years. In his efforts to achieve health for the Earth’s ecosystems, however, he found himself conflicted over environmentalism’s means and the ends those means actually achieved. With that in mind, he began investigating and writing about success stories where active participation by humans in the ecosystems they depended on for livelihoods made the environment healthier than if they were not there. Two of his books, "Beyond the Rangeland Conflict" and "Gardeners of Eden - Rediscovering Our Importance to Nature" have thus been influential for many of us concerned about the serious environmental problems confronting the contemporary American West. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-160-dan-dagget-peoples-contributions-nature-and-ecosystem-successes-southwest-us for links to more of Dan's work, including photos on his website which he mentions in the interview, and these books.

"Let me write the songs of a nation, and I care not who writes its laws." People think they are primarily 'thinking things', but this quote by a musician from ancient Athens speaks to the fact that most of our decision-making and the direction of our efforts in the world are shaped more by our affections. Creative and expressive arts are hugely influential. And we should pay as much attention to what feeds our minds as we do to what feeds our physical bodies, and of course, we realize increasingly realize how connected minds and bodies are. This short monologue is an effort to get scientists to think about creative expression for science communication for artists to think scientifically about what values they portray and encourage in works of art. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-159-can-creative-arts-affect-public-perception-about-rangelands-brief-musing-tip for some related imagery and links to the project website.

Visual arts that draw attention to wild, open spaces have been culturally important in the United States. The outdoors painters of the late 19th and early 20th centuries were instrumental in making Americans aware of spectacularly beautiful places most people would not know about otherwise. And they catalyzed efforts to conserve these landscapes for ecological value and future enjoyment. Frank Stick was one of those painters, one whose work flowed out of deep personal experience and love of nature. Mike Mordell is an outdoorsman, forestry executive, and art collector who authored an illustrated biography of Frank Stick to draw attention to this important work. Art shapes us, directs our affections. Listen to this episode with Mike about the artwork of Frank Stick, "splendid painter of the out-of-doors." The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Transcript and links to resources mentioned in this episode are at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-158-frank-stick-splendid-painter-out-doors-biographer-mike-mordell

Can we effectively limit wildfire risk or change the fire risk profile using deliberate grazing? Or is this just wishful, simplistic thinking: "Cows eat fine fuel so that stops fire, right?" These are questions that demand scientific answers, not just anecdotes or coffee shop opinions. Sergio Arispe has worked with other researchers in the Western U.S. to better understand numerous questions around grazing for fire control and to fine-tune the timing, duration, intensity, and frequency of grazing that is most effective in shifting the plant community toward fire resiliency. A current ranch-scale research project aims to understand winter grazing effects on cheatgrass populations and associated wildfire risk in the subsequent summer. This is a timely topic for most rangelands in North America and especially drier ecosystem types with any species of exotic annual grasses. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-157-grazing-fine-fuels-management-and-wildfire-mitigation-sergio-arispe for links to websites and research papers mentioned in this interview.

Over 15 years ago, the veteran journalist Steve Stuebner and Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission executive Gretchen Hyde set out to use the new media landscape to tell good news stories about rangeland landscapes and the unique people who care for them. This has been a wildly successful venture that has reached far beyond the borders of Idaho. Listen to this interview with Steve and Gretchen about the recent "15-year retrospective" story and video on Life on the Range. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Visit the episode page at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-156-15-years-life-range-steve-stuebner-gretchen-hyde for a full transcript of the interview and links to resources mentioned in this episode.

The National Grazing Lands Coalition (NatGLC) promotes and supports ecologically and economically sound management of grazing lands for multiple benefits to the environment and society through science-based technical assistance, research, and education. Bill Fox has been with NatGLC since the beginning. In this interview, Dr. Fox offers a condensed history of NatGLC and what the organization is doing now. We visit with Jack Field about the June 2025 summer tour in Washington State. From the tour website: "Pacific Pastures promises to be an unforgettable grazing tour, bringing together farmers, ranchers, and agriculture industry professionals. Participants will have the unique opportunity to network and engage with peers in a stunning backdrop that highlights the diverse landscapes and rich agricultural heritage of the Pacific Northwest. The event will feature an immersive experience that showcases innovative farming practices, sustainable ranching techniques, and the region's unique character. Attendees can look forward to forging valuable connections, sharing insights, and exploring the vibrant agricultural community that defines this remarkable region. Don't miss the chance to be part of this enriching experience that celebrates the heart of Pacific agriculture." The Art of Range Podcast is supported by Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Go to https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-154-national-grazing-lands-coalition-summer-tour-pacific-northwest for the full transcript and links to resources mentioned in this episode.

Does grazing management make a difference? Can we raise livestock and wildlife and take carbon out of the atmosphere and put it in soil on the same piece of land? Meet Peter Byck, self-described scientist wrangler and producer of Roots So Deep, a four-part documentary series that explores the world of adaptive cattle farmers and their conventional farming neighbors. Adaptive multi-paddock grazing is one of the faces of regenerative agriculture. Listen to this interview to learn about researched results from caring for land well. The Roots So Deep documentary film series shows, rather than tells, how we can have our cake and eat it too -- how grazing patterns can increase soil carbon, increase wildlife diversity, reduce water runoff and soil erosion, and improve financial health of family farms. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Go to https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-155-roots-so-deep-you-can-see-devil-down-there-filmmaker-peter-byck for the full transcript and links to resources mentioned in this episode.

Can Farmer-Founded Fibers Save American Fashion? Cate Havstad-Casad, founder of RangeRevolution leather goods, and Ed Mouw, president of Duckworth wool clothing answered this question in a pre-panel interview at SXSW with Ed Roberson joining in. If Duckworth and Range Revolution are not on your radar screen, and if Mountain & Prairie Podcast isn't in your podcast feed, they should be now. Ed R interviewed Cate and Ed M in a SXSW talk the day after we recorded this preparatory interview. We discuss supply chain challenges, what is fashion, the recent renaissance of wool, and why natural fibers are superior to synthetics (let me count the ways). Go to https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-153-back-future-american-fibers-cate-havstad-ed-mouw-ed-roberson-sxsw for links and the transcript of this interview.

The concept of carrying capacity has figured prominently in rangeland ecology and wildlife biology for a century and more. Where did this term come from? Nathan Sayre, a cultural geographer at UC-Berkeley and the author of the book "Politics of Scale - a History of Rangeland Science," answers this question. According to Sayre, "It is a truism that the Earth’s resources are finite, and that human demands must therefore be kept within some bounds. But this idea has a history fraught with intellectual and political problems. My work on scarcity, carrying capacity, and related ideas explores how these terms and concepts emerged, traces their shifting meanings over time, and reveals their hidden assumptions and flaws." Our conversation centers around an article he wrote titled "The Genesis, History, and Limits of Carrying Capacity." The origins of the idea and the term, which has been controversial socially, ecologically, and economically, may surprise you. Visit the episode page to download the article or access the full transcript of this interview: https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-152-nathan-sayre-genesis-and-limits-carrying-capacity

The Sterling Wildlife Management Area in southeast Idaho suffered from accumulated dead cattails, bulrushes, and grasses. Wildlife the area is intended habitat for were avoiding it, especially migratory waterfowl. This Life on the Range story with rancher Chase Carter and biologist Maria Pacioretty describes their successful efforts to use targeted grazing in winter to consume and transform the overburden of dead vegetation. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center. Access the rest of the story and the excellent video on this project from https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-151-targeted-grazing-wetland-health-maria-pacioretty-chase-carter, where you can also find a full transcript of this interview.

Bildo Saravia is the owner and manager of Rancho el Ojo and Origien Raiz Mezcal. His story showcases the ways global marketing and communication can benefit local people oriented around rangeland economies. By "grazing the wild" he is growing agave in sustainable polyculture with a diversity of other native plants for livestock and wildlife in Durango, Mexico. Go to the episode page, https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-150-bildo-saravia-lauren-svejcar-artisanal-mezcal-ranching-mexico, for links and the full transcript.

Dr. Germino’s latest research, published in the Communications Earth & Environment journal in November 2024, reveals a startling and significant finding: invasive grasses are turning western U.S. rangelands from valuable carbon sinks into potential carbon sources. This research, a two-year collaboration between the US Geological Survey and Envu, provides the first comprehensive assessment of the impact of invasive annual grasses, like cheatgrass, on soil carbon stocks. The study found that the conversion of native perennial shrublands to these invasive grasslands can result in a 42-49% reduction in soil carbon, releasing a significant amount of carbon dioxide into the atmosphere. It also found that wildfire and grass invasion had a similar impact on soil carbon stocks, a surprising finding that challenges previous assumptions about the relative impacts of these disturbances. Dr. Germino is joined by another study author, Dr. Harry Quicke from Envu. They discuss implications of this new research for rangeland management and potential solutions. This is part 2 of the discussion. To hear the first part, go to episode 147. A full transcript of the episode and links to articles are at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-149-wildfire-depletes-ecosystem-carbon-storage-50-part-2-germino-maxwell-quicke. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center.

A research study in the mountains of Idaho tracked cheatgrass consumption by sheep in the spring and fall. Listen to Kelly Hopping (Boise State University) and sheep rancher Riley Kowitz describe their experiences with implementing this approach to controlling invasive annual grass and changing the wildfire risk profile on the Sawtooth National Forest. Go to https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-148-targeted-cheatgrass-grazing-research-sheep-kelly-hopping-riley-kowitz to see the video and read the full story. The Art of Range Podcast is supported by Vence, a subsidiary of Merck Animal Health; the Idaho Rangeland Resources Commission; and the Western Extension Risk Management Education Center.

How does wildfire affect soil carbon, the ecological currency of the 21st century? Careful collaborative research involving US Geological Survey scientists, Envu, and Boise State University has begun to answer some of the many questions surrounding soil carbon and fire. This is the first of a two-part interview on soil carbon storage, sequestration mechanisms, effects of wildfire and plant community shifts, and management implications. Be sure to read the Open Access paper at https://artofrange.com/episodes/aor-147-wildfire-depletes-ecosystem-carbon-storage-50-part-1-germino-maxwell-quicke, where you will also find the usual transcript and links to other resources.