The Art of Longevity

In an era dominated by playlists, TikTok, Reels and Shorts, reduced attention spans and endless content, Karnivool doubled down on the album as a complete statement - the album as the antidote. As Drew Goddard says. “In the age of content, I thought it was even more important to release an album.” For Karnivool, the album remains more than a collection of tracks. It is a long-form quest (in this case, lasting 12 years), both for the band and the listener. “I struggle with focus,” Goddard explains, “so committing to a long-form thing was important. Something that could hold people captive for a little bit. Stop them in their tracks.” At this point, it hits hard just how much work goes into the making of an album, especially one as epic as In Verses. With each passing year, Karnivool fans' patience was tested and their expectations, inevitably, notched upwards. I don’t think anyone will be disappointed, but perhaps it would help for the band to crack on towards the next album…soonish. Despite the long wait, the band insists they weren’t consciously responding to external pressure. “We weren’t really thinking about the stakes,” Jon Stockman says. “We were so embroiled in the process itself.” After 12 years, the achievement is not just the record itself. “We’re still friends,” Stockman notes. “We’re still enjoying it.” In a career defined by patience and precision, simply arriving together for a new album and what many may see as a career-defining tour, may be Karnivool’s greatest artistic statement yet. And that may be an understatement. The Art of Longevity is powered by Bang & Olufsen [full article on website] Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

I gave Sean Rowley a call after writing up an article on “Unguilty Pleasures” (see Chill Gonzales episode 64) - Gonzales' campaign against music snobbery and treatise on the pleasures of Enya's music. It became clear that the story of Rowley's own creation, Guilty Pleasures, was very much a candidate for the Art of Longevity. Guilty Pleasures became that wonderful thing - a content brand (before we called them that) that grew octopus arms. The club nights quickly grew by word-of-mouth, expanding to multiple venues, festivals, and international events, and becoming a fixture of the UK nightlife scene. Then came a series of successful compilation CDs, at a time when compilations still did big business in music. It went on to radio, live tours, and special events (including opening for George Michael at the new Wembley Stadium), helping to popularise nostalgia-driven and feel-good music culture. In Rowley’s own words “nostalgia is a fucking wonderful thing”. Well, he did make a career out of it, so he would understand. For an idea to build the way it has, and to last so long, it needed to be something deeper. With Guilty Pleasures, Rowley challenged prevailing ideas of musical “taste” and helped normalise the celebration of mainstream pop, even in alternative spaces. He gave music snobbery a good clobbering and in doing so, established a legacy on DJ culture and the wider acceptance of joyful, communal music experiences. The evidence is everywhere: the enormously popular Despacio Disco launched by James Murphy (of LCD Soundsystem) and the Dewaele brothers (of Soulwax and 2ManyDJs). And then James Gunn of course, with the Guardians of The Galaxy soundtrack, which mined similar territory. The pandemic brought us Sophie Ellis-Bextor’s Kitchen Disco. Tik Tok has of course done wonders for the “genre”- famous for making Matthew Wilder’s “Break My Stride” a sensation, now with 500m streams on Spotify. And on it goes, the sprawling influence of a simple idea that is underpinned by the even simpler concept of the joy of music. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Emerging from Edinburgh’s music scene in the mid-1990s, Idlewild carved out their place in a British rock scene choc-a-bloc with guitar bands (the halo of Britpop) through a combination of emotional intensity and literary edge. All of this is present in the band still, right down to new song “Back Then You Found Me” name checking Dylan Thomas’s Under Milk Wood. Their 1998 debut album, Hope Is Important, announced them as something more than just another Scottish guitar band. Their songs were tight, but angular, and threaded with Woomble’s poetic phrasing and a strong melodic core. Did Idlewild have the boom and bust fame of Brett Anderson’s “Stations of the Cross” career curve (on which this podcast is based, I remind you)? Of a sort, yes. Building on an acclaimed debut album (Broken Windows), 2002’s The Remote Part, Idlewild reached a classic creative x commercial peak. That album is perhaps still their most well known - a more expansive, anthemic sound without abandoning the sensibilities that had become their trademark. It contained bona fide chart hits, “You Held the World in Your Arms” and “American English” and set the band on the way to being one of the key British bands in the early 2000s. But in a sense, the “stratospheric rise to the top” was kept well in check. Perhaps it was personnel changes (I haven’t counted but the band has had more than its fair share of bassists). They pivoted toward a warmer, more reflective style on Warnings/Promises (2005), incorporating folk influences and richer textures. It bridged the band to maturity and opened up their options but ultimately did not satisfy the major label they were signed to, Parlophone. An arena tour with Coldplay somewhat exposed Idlewild’s “limitations” if you want to put it that way - not musically, but in terms of performance - the will and the way to take their show to the big stages expected by major labels. There was no meltdown, no drama. But major label life is what it is - both back then, and in the present time. “Our label mates were Kylie Minogue, Radiohead, Coldplay and Blur. We were definitely at the bottom of that pile”. When Parlophone didn’t want to renew a new deal after four albums, it was time for the band to re-adjust. To Woomble, it was liberating - eventually. “For Make Another World, we felt like we’d toured enough, we had a fan base. Then after Post Electric Blues (2009) we decided to take some time away. As a band we felt intact, but we also felt like we wanted to stay up at the level we were, not to end up just playing clubs. The music business was so strange then (2007), we ended up taking five years away and came back with a renewed sense of what we could do, creatively”. Their string of subsequent albums, Everything Ever Written (2015), Interview Music (2019) and now Idlewild all have something to offer, and demonstrate the band’s refusal to stagnate. The one-two punch of Woomble’s poetic lyrics and Jones’s jagged, urgent guitar work still delivers something, if not unique, then most definitely a cut above standard indie fare - more depth, more emotion. Few bands transition successfully from ragged punk-inflected rock to expansive indie-folk, but Idlewild managed it without alienating their audience or diluting their artistic character. In short, Idlewild’s career is a testament to thoughtful songwriting, evolution, and the enduring power of emotionally intelligent rock. Most definitely an interesting and quietly inspiring longevity story. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

I’ve been trying to get Tim Burgess to join me on The Art of Longevity for at least 10 seasons. Ultimately, a new Charlatans album, We Are Love, seemed like the right reason to finally do it. I’ve said it before, but I’m genuinely amazed and thrilled about how many ‘old bands’ have put out a recent album that is up there with their very best work. Suede, The Manics, Nada Surf, Tindersticks et. al. And I’m delighted to now include The Charlatans in that club. The band’s new album, #14 no less, is wonderful. Confident, varied, suitably different but very much representative, it’s a thoughtful and entertaining record throughout, containing some of the band’s best songs for ages; notably both the lead singles, opener Kingdom Of Ours, Appetite, For The Girls, You Can’t Push The River and, Tim’s own choice - Out On Our Own. But honestly, this is another cracking end-to-end listen with none of the filler that has perhaps been there in the past on some Charlatans offerings (along with all those above mentioned bands). “I’m really confident that it will seep in. We’re enigmatic and thugs as well. Some of it bangs you over the head but it has an emotional impact that I think, gets there”. ]Like many people of a certain vintage, The Charlatans have been one of those reassuring presences in my life over the years. Perhaps never the best or the biggest, The Charlatans longevity story has been to simply keep on keeping on, eventually unfolding into a slow-burning surprise journey towards British indie rock legend. You may not have predicted it back in the early days, despite a couple of genuine early hits, but when a band finds its formula and works at it, the miracles come later. Some early success in 1990 brought the top 5 hit “The Only One I Know”, but it wasn’t a linear rise from that point on. By album five, Telling Stories (1997) the band had a genuine classic album on their hands, including the legendary indie hit “One To Another” (which new single “Deeper And Deeper” nods to brilliantly). With that momentum, the Charlatans crossed the rubicon into longevity, establishing themselves as one of the more enduring British indie bands, with genuine peaks of popular success (three UK number one albums). When I asked Tim the secret to the band’s longevity, he’s pretty clear with the answer: “The reason why people are into older bands now is that they don’t all sound the same. Now, everyone sounds the same but has to invent a persona to be different, whereas we [old bands] all are, effortlessly different”. From the get go, the band’s instrumentation, with the late Rob Collins’s Hammond organ at its core, gave The Charlatans a distinctive fusion of indie rock, soul, psychedelia and dance music. But with due respect to the band’s sound, much of the enduring fondness for the band comes from Tim Burgess himself. His vocal style is sunny but with underlying yearning, his style as a frontman effortlessly optimistic and embracing. And while Burgess remains best known as a singer and frontman of this band, he has also pursued a range of solo, collaborative and curatorial projects that make him something of a “renaissance man” and, as I suggest in our conversation, something of a National Treasure. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

“I don't know where I'm going from here, but I promise it won't be boring.” Those words were spoken at one time by David Bowie, and thus are gospel to us here on The Art of Longevity podcast. Fortunately, some bands still live by that same philosophy. For evidence, we revisit the world of Suede. Suede has refused to become boring. Somehow, this band of 40 years have gone the other way - more exciting and visceral than ever. Suede are not hanging about to become their own echo! Albums like Autofiction and now, its immediate follow-up Antidepressants are not just the proverbial ‘return to form’ type records. They are nothing short of a reinvention. Mat Osman, co-founder member with Brett Anderson and bass player, shares his views on the new Suede record: “It feels like Autofiction on steroids. If Autofication was a TV show, Antidepressants is the film version. We took everything more widescreen with this record”. However, for Osman - you can forget about that old cliche of a band making music for themselves and hoping the world will agree (that’s what Rick Rubin has been telling us with The Creative Act: A Way of Being and to be fair, more than a few artists have told me it works for them. It's not for Suede. Instead, the band’s creative mission has been guided by their fans - their reactions at live shows, to the band directly, but also the band’s own interpretation of what a Suede audience really wants. “A band without an audience isn’t a band. It’s a hobby,” Osman declares. That emotional connection is Mat’s affirmation - fan tattoos of favourite songs, tears at gigs, and stories about Suede songs at weddings. This fan connection is Suede’s compass in the band’s 4th career phase. And so we return to a key central theme of longevity; usefulness to people. “As I get older, those moments where someone says, ‘That song helped me,’ mean everything,” he reflects. “That’s what I’m proud of. There’s a community feel [between the band and the fans] that becomes more and more important. It’s evident from this ‘Revisited’ episode, that Mat Osman and Brett Anderson have a fair degree of telepathy on many things - a shared vision that no doubt has added focus to Suede’s current run of creative form. They even agree on the most ironic thing about where Suede has arrived; that they were the least likely band to survive in the first place. “Longevity is not something we strived for, it just happened as a side effect of our bloody mindedness and passion for making music”. They still have it. Season 12 of The Art of Longevity is Powered by Bang & Olufsen. Long copy can be found on www.songsommelier.com. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Now well over a decade in the music industry, Tom Odell is motoring through a successful second phase as an independent artist. His recent albums have leaned into more introspective, personal material that has resonated so much that he now attracts bigger audiences to bigger shows (an arena tour is forthcoming), and continues to grow a very large base of listeners on the streaming platforms. Indeed, he sits comfortably (and ironically) within Spotify’s elite of Top 200 streaming artists. He is in the 0.01% of working artists, the “Billions Club”, a place he never set out to be but nevertheless, belongs. Odell broke free of the major label system (not his choice at the time but transformational as it turned out) three albums ago, to find a whole new level of creative and commercial success. Most of all, with his seventh studio album A Wonderful Life on the horizon, the singer-songwriter has found a renewed sense of purpose. His time touring with artists like Billie Eilish and the Lumineers has given him a first-hand glimpse of the very top tier of success in a changed industry, a secret sauce that may well rub off on him more as a result of those experiences. Odell is a hopeful soul. In a world of quantity over quality, 100,000 songs a day and AI about to increase that number ad infinitum, he has a strong idea about where a solution may lie to all the madness. “I really have faith in the listener. I believe people will find the good stuff. And when I look at what’s big right now, most of the time I go, ‘Yeah, that’s really good, that’s why it's big”. As A Wonderful Life gets closer to release, Odell isn’t looking to chase the numbers, or meet any industry expectations. He’s following the music. “I didn’t get into this to be big,” he says. “I got into it because I love it. And I still do.” His Spotify biog says it all. No flowery press copy, no AI generated summary, no self-penned promo, just 33 million monthly listeners and a simple keyboard smile emoji. One wonders how far he will go. Season 12 of The Art of Longevity is Powered by Bang & Olufsen. Long copy can be found on www.songsommelier.com. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Singer-songwriter Amy MacDonald has never been one to chase trends - an impressive show of resistance for an artist whose music journey began with teenage stardom (the streaming monster hit “This Is The Life” was all over the radio when she was just 19). Macdonald could be forgiven for trying to stay in the spotlight, but she was never that bothered about industry fuss in the first place, protected as she is by a finely tuned bullshit detector, a birthright for anyone born in the vicinity of Glasgow. That said, as her career has developed (she is now on her sixth album), MacDonald admits to worrying more…about mostly everything. New album Is This What You’ve Been Waiting For? is a cheeky dig at years of being asked when new music was coming, yet it comes with a certain anxiety about how it will go down, about how the world sees her now. “I keep myself up at night just thinking about shite basically, it's ingrained in me - I just want it to be good for everybody involved”. Staying grounded matters to Macdonald. When asked what she’s most proud of, her answer is modest but telling: “That I’m still doing this. There were so many times I thought I was going to sack it all in. But here I am, album six, and people still seem to be interested.” It's easy to forget how much responsibility falls on the shoulders of solo musicians. It’s as if the strength of her songwriting might not be enough. But it is. Season 12 of The Art of Longevity is Powered by Bang & Olufsen. Long copy can be found on www.songsommelier.com. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

In the intervening four years since Ollie Knights first joined me, the band has been on something of a creative roll; two fine albums, a successful acoustic tour and something of a collective raising of the game. To my mind, this is how established bands of longevity should operate; to hell with the mainstream and gatekeepers, just do the very best work you can and keep those fans happy. The new Turin Brakes album Spacehopper saw the band going back to the start - recording the album at Konk, the recording studio founded by The Kinks in 1973 and where Turin Brakes recorded their classic debut The Optimist. This of course, was in contrast to the homely recording of post-pandemic Wide Eyed Nowhere, still a fine record but very different in character to Spacehopper. This time around too, the lead single from the new album, “The Message”, had some much deserved radio play on BBC Radio 2. But still, no hits to speak of, and the album reached the UK chart for just a fleeting moment. A hit would be nice for this band, but Ollie Knights remains more philosophical than ever: “You take the wins where you can. Our happiness levels are less influenced by “success” in the mainstream areas. We’ve finally learned after decades of smashing up against the wall. We get over it very quickly if something is disappointing in the mainstream realm. That’s the bit you were not thinking about when you were dreaming about a career in music as a kid”. Indeed. For bands of Quiet Legend, still making excellent records and blowing the roof off venues live - it’s time to build your own momentum. There’s a lot to learn from Turin Brakes. To be contrarian for a moment though, this band may still get their moment. When you consider that those early classic hits (remember “Pain Killer” was a top five UK hit in the summer of 2003, whilst the band’s first chart single “The Underdog (Save Me)” has become an evergreen classic) are still relatively understreamed. The band’s biggest song on Spotify remains the 2016 ballad Save You with just over seven million streams. Sooner or later, that is bound to change, but until it does, the band continues to thrive organically, with or without the accolades. Their momentum is such that they are back in a place where it's still exciting after 25 years. “There is always something on the workbench. The chemistry between me and Gale and between the four of us - without those relationships, forget it. We look forward to getting together and playing, we’re excited about it. And when people come to see us live it's as if they want to come and watch the relationships happen”. Turin Brakes are the indie folk band that rocks. Good luck to them. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Estelle is old school. With a modern twist yes, but nonetheless, if this most eclectic of artists leans in any particular direction it is towards ‘classic’. She even says it in one her own songs; "I'm not of-the-moment. I am a classic, yeah, I live at the MoMA” (The Life, opening track of her 2012 album All of Me). She is quite the proverbial eclectic artist - edgy but not (un)necessarily shocking, traditional but modern enough to make her point in the era of precision-tool song production, and forever flitting between a dozen sub-genres (across hip hop, R&B, pop, reggae and soul). Classify Estelle at your peril. New album Stay Alta has throwback quality to it that is extremely welcome in the current climate. Although it was conceived as a post-pandemic record, it works effectively as a tonic for the turbulent times we are living through right now. It channels Diana Ross, Donna Summer, Stevie Wonder and…Melba Moore. Like records by those artists, Stay Alta is an organic listen and auto-tune is strictly off limits. But somehow, it is modern. Stay Alta themes include gratitude, celebration, joy and defiance but not the migraine-inducing platitudinal kind - just the straightforward take it or leave it kind. You should take it. It is album number six across a career of two decades, so Estelle does not subscribe to FOBF, the “fear of being forgotten” that is the scourge of many modern pop artists in today’s fast-flowing pop scene. Instead, she is happy to take her time. There is something to note in her approach about time, longevity, and lineage. Estelle seems acutely aware of whose shoulders she stands on. It’s not unconnected to the fact that The Estelle Show (her 5-days a week Apple Music radio show, which won an esteemed Gracie Award for Women In Media) provides a platform to put her fellow peers and new artists in context alongside legendary artists. Classics and new classics sit side by side - why can’t broadcast radio pull that off? Anyhow, credit to Estelle. It was her idea, her pitch to Apple, and now it's her show. And that is how Estelle rolls. At this stage, she is a serious artist living outside of the mainstream and not really in need of a hit anyhow. But yes, she is a songwriter and an artist with the potential to strike at any time. She knows where she is from and how to reach deep into that well. “I see credit and beauty in artists who know where they come from because you then have a well to pull from. If I know funk and I’m a new era funk artist I know where to find that bassline. If I’m a drum & bass artist I can go to that Roni Size beat and sample it or repurpose it. Nothing’s new under the sun”. Damn right. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

During our live interview with Skye Edwards and Ross Godfrey of Morcheeba, I found myself at one stage scrolling through my notes to find a description of the band’s sound I’d queried using Chat GPT. I couldn’t find it at the time but here is what it said: “Morcheeba’s signature rich, mellow music became the soundtrack of the suburban homes and chillout rooms of the late 90s and early 00s”. That’s a composite of much that has been written about the band over some 30 years, and it doesn’t really flatter does it? “The devil’s own lounge band” is the quip that Skye Edwards recalled from an early review. The music press loves to characterise bands, but in Morcheeba’s case, it comes across somewhat dumbed down. Contained within Morcheeba’s mellow sounds are multiple layers of influence that reveal hidden depths with every listen. The interview with the band for this launch episode for The Art of Longevity (Season 12!) manages to scratch just beneath the surface at least. That said, Morcheeba know their place in making music that can be the perfect backdrop, to quote Ross Godfrey: “We’ve always made relaxing music. You can get home from work on a Friday night, have a glass of wine or smoke a spliff or whatever and play our music”. On the other hand, the sheer depth of their musical influences and references can be breathtaking. Within the mix are Bacharach, Barry and Moriconi of course, but also Brazilian late 60s Tropicalia, and somewhat less obviously (but most certainly in terms of always impressive guitar work) classic rock from Ross Godfrey’s childhood favourites Neil Young and Jimi Hendrix. Meanwhile, Skye’s lyrics and styles include 70s country music, along with ska and dub reggae. All of this is somehow weaved into the seamless Morcheeba sound on the new outstanding album Escape The Chaos. Launched in the mid-90s and quickly swept along on the British ‘trip-hop’ wave, Morcheeba outlasted most of their contemporaries including Portishead (who refused to heed to the repeated calls to re-form). Morcheeba is one of those bands you might easily have forgotten about. And yet the band has (give or take a short hiatus and shuffling of personnel sometime between 2003 and 2009) steadily worked their way to 11 albums over 30 years, most of it under the radar of music industry gatekeepers and without much love from the music press. “They hated us” was Skye Edward’s response when I brought up the subject of early press reviews. And yet, Pitchfork gave their debut album Who Can You Trust (1996) an 8.3/10, but then stopped loving them as the band’s popularity took off. Recent single We Live & Die references “in the old days of NME” which had me going on to Wayback Machine to dig out an NME review from 1998 of the breakthrough album Big Calm. It was the now legendary music critic Syvia Patterson, who wrote: “Morcheeba you see, sounds nothing like Portishead. They sound like they like life”. That has certainly proved a lasting observation. And Morcheeba has proved a lasting British trip hop institution. One of the few 90s bands that just seem to keep on getting better and better. This live episode launches a new partnership between The Art of Longevity and Bang & Olufsen. Find more details on the Song Sommelier web pages. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Light, fire, water, fruit, and worms; “just the basics”, are Matt Berninger’s recurring themes, and these emerge again on his second solo album Get Sunk. One of life’s sponges, Berninger is constantly observing and recording the world around him - on paper scraps, whiteboards, garageband files, notes-to-self via text messages and even on baseballs. The sketches of songs ideas, lyrics and poems are transcribed from his brain to his fingertips, ready to go when the songwriting process gets underway. Once you understand this, it’s easier to see just how the man has become prolific. Having written lyrics for not one but two albums with his band The National in 2023, his catalogue of solo works is fast developing, first album Serpentine Prison arrived in 2021 (a substantial achievement given that Berninger had some debilitating bouts of depression around the COVID period). After the exercise in traditional, classic song making that was Serpentine Prison, new album Get Sunk is much more an indie pop record not a million miles from The National. It even contains a surefire hit (in the parallel universe where good songs become hits), in the form of drivetime indie single Bonnet Of Pins, destined to become a firm fan favourite. Coming in at 10 tracks, Get Sunk is a lean, mean machine of well-crafted, mid-paced indie and easy on the ear ballads. It’s a consistently engaging listen, but some songs, Frozen Oranges, Little By Little, Nowhere Special really showcase Berninger’s powers. If this was the 80s, Matt Berninger would have a solo hit record on his hands and a parallel successful career as rock band frontman and solo artist. But, given this is the 21st century streaming era, he’ll have to make do with a modestly successful outlet for his prolific creativity - some half-million listeners on his Spotify profile as validation. It’s a worthwhile endeavour. Besides, having extra-curricular projects is critical to longevity - very much one of our underlying themes. Berninger’s core project, The National, are a rare exception to the rule of a band’s career as the proverbial rollercoaster ride. No stratospheric rise as such, more a steady climb. No ‘disintegration’ or crash to the bottom for this band, who continue to go from strength to strength it seems. They’ve never been dropped, now having made 10 albums over 25 years - all of them on the ultra-cool indie label 4AD. The band now is the original line up since the beginning and since The National is Berninger plus two sets of twins, any alternative seems unthinkable. If every band wants the career of Radiohead, then the career of The National can’t be too far behind in the dreams of young friends forming indie bands in every small corner of the world. Still, it took a minute. As Berninger quips “longevity takes a long time”...before elaborating on the early days: “We were ignored for the first couple of records, nobody paid attention to us until Alligator and Boxer. Those records were hard fought, but by then, we had four records and so you couldn’t pin us down. Then Annie Clark (St. Vincent) and Sufjan Stephens started helping us and we grew this community in Brooklyn that became a really healthy thing for all of us”. Creating a body of work of some four albums before registering on the radar is the way to go, if you can get away with it. By the time High Violet came around in 2010 (and its highly successful successors Trouble Will Find Me, Sleep Well Beast), The National were a bona fide transatlantic success. More than that, however, they represent (probably along with Arctic Monkeys) how a band of the 21st century can achieve a kind of success that is, in essence, a throwback to the old world. Despite this and maybe becau Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Valerie June’s journey to what we might call ‘cult stardom’ hasn’t been easy. “I was cleaning houses while playing bars & clubs at night. And I had a vision that I would not make it - my music wouldn't reach its audience through regular means - it would reach its audience through musicians. My friends would help me. I’m a musician’s musician”. Working through a talented community of musicians that has included Booker T, Brandi Carlise and none other than Mavis Staples, eventually brought Valerie June together with her own audience. For her new project, June works with Blind Boys of Alabama, Norah Jones, DJ Cavem Moetavation and M Ward, supremo guitarist and producer of new album Owls, Omens and Oracles. I wanted to get her view of her own music, because the music business loves to put artists in lanes, boxes and pigeon holes. How on earth did an eclectic artist like June slip through the cracks? Her music has been described by others as an amalgam of soul, gospel, Appalachian folk, bluegrass, country, spiritual pop, African blues and my own favourite…cosmic rock. How does she describe her music in response to this assessment? With a joyful guffaw and an emphatic reaction: “I’m a singer-songwriter. I follow the songs, whatever they want to be is what I do. I’m kinda like their servant. All those names related to the music - I used to get attached to those and now I don’t ”. In Jeff Tweedy’s entertaining memoir World Within a Song, the author, singer songwriter and Wilco frontman says: “Taking something old and making it sound modern is nothing new”. And yet obsessing over your references, but melding them into something that is uniquely you is one of the key themes for artists of longevity. Both concepts are critical to June’s work. “I do commune with the ancestors. I know I’m standing on the shoulders of many who came before me. I feel them beside me as I’m talking now. I’m not doing this by myself. I wanted to understand my people through music, and I got there through studying the blues”. Most songs come to me as voices. I’ll try this instrument and be like “no, not that one…like Goldilocks. I try many different instruments to connect that voice to what it wants. Then, I found a team of people to listen to and understand”. If Valerie June really is the Goldilocks of songcraft, the results are indeed nourishing. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

With the album’s reduced commercial clout and declining role in music consumption, a dilemma crops up for all long-established bands involved in the endeavour of making a new LP record. Put simply, why bother? Why toil for four years on a body of work that distils 100 song ideas into ten tracks, spending a fortune in the process, only to see it flash across the charts and then evaporate into the mesh of 100 million songs? It’s an existential question for Ricky Ross of Deacon Blue, who told me: “It’s sort of madness really, when all the good songs and books have already been written. Who wants to hear what’s in my head or what we’ve created as a band? Does anyone even sit down and listen to an album now? But I think of it in the same way as poets, novelists and filmmakers. It’s still worth doing if you feel you can do it well”. Arguably, new albums have been especially challenging for Deacon Blue in part because the band made one of the most accomplished debuts ever, 1987’s Raintown. With its themes of growing up in Glasgow, work, money, expectations and dreams, Raintown is as universal a concept as any record and yet it is fundamentally a musical tribute to Glasgow that most Scots are really proud of. It set a high bar for Deacon Blue, and yet the band went on to have acute commercial success with the four albums that followed between 1989 and 1994, rounding the period off with a Greatest Hits compilation (remember them!) Our Town, in 1994. The band then split, and you can’t say they didn’t quit while they were ahead. They each went on to have their own multi-media career ventures, acting, writing and presenting, effectively avoiding the inevitable mid-career slump of many of their contemporaries. Alas, they came back together in 1999 and the second act has been a classic post limelight affair. A string of lower key albums placed them firmly in the ‘for fans only’ vortex of music careers - perfectly sustainable and yet largely forgotten by the mainstream. It hasn’t stopped the band hitting creative highs with albums though, notably 2014’s A New House and the outstanding City of Love in 2020. But when the journey continues, where do you go next? The answer seems to be ‘full circle, then forward’. New album The Great Western Road arrives on a momentous anniversary for Deacon Blue, it is 40 years since songwriter and frontman Ricky Ross and drummer Dougie Vipond created the group’s first incarnation. With the opening title track set in Glasgow, it’s more than a nod to their debut (indeed, the title track echoes Raintown’s opener Born In A Storm, a ‘Gershwin meets Glasgow’ classic). The band reunited with Raintown recording engineer Matt Butler and so were clearly ready to revisit their origins. But as the new album unfolds, so does the metaphor of the band stretching out further and further. The result is a bunch of songs that reflect the sense of expectation of their early work with reflection, perspective and a contented resignation. Classic country songs How We Remember It and Curve of the Line are particular highlights of a mature, grown up pop record. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

A new album release by your favourite band is an important event. Thank god for this. A new album is a reprieve, an escape, a comfort and a joy. Of course, to experience all these emotions you do have to take the time to really listen. I particularly love that a record has the power to be your own personal time machine. When I first played back the new My Morning Jacket album, simply titled is, I was transported back in time to the late 70s, back to my childhood. A time of albums on vinyl or cassette, played on ‘music centres’ (that’s what we called hi-fi systems in Northern England back then). A time when ELO or Supertramp, or The Stranglers or Queen, would make albums consisting of singles with accessible catchy melodies mixed with more exotic, experimental songs that were probably marked during the recording process as ‘album tracks’. A time when you could expect each and every album released by a band to have a different, distinctive character from the last one. It was a time of greater attention and patience and a slower, simpler time of life. 70s memories are especially magical for me, so a soundtrack courtesy Jim James & co is a total treat. It isn’t fashionable music that My Morning Jacket creates. Indeed, their alchemical meld of alt-country rock, alternative country/Americana and late era Beatles-esque psychedelia make MMJ sound always like a band out of time. That’s just how Jim James intended it. Music perfect for sucking you into their timeless orbit. And no real desire beyond that. It’s the way Jim James operates these days. Put your best work out there into the universe and then what will be will be: “Of course we all want our work to be successful, me included. But I’ve ridden the rollercoaster so many times now, I know the outcome is always the same, whether people like a record or not, I still had to deal with my own depression and self loathing. External validation will not fill that hole, you can only do it yourself, love yourself and try to see things more clearly”. MMJ have never shied away from dissonance, off kilter time signatures and ear-splitting guitar work, but there is always the emergence of beauty from the noise. This abruptly contrasting style takes a backseat on is. Instead, the songs are what matters most on this album. Legendary rock producer Brendan O'Brien (Pearl Jam, Springsteen and ACDC) has pushed Jim James and his band to be even more in service of the songs than they have been before. But the melodies and grooves are so strong, it works wonders such that the album stands up as one of their best so far. Pretty good show after 25 years and 10 LP records. And Jim James loves LP records: “I love the album as an art form. It’s important as artists to do what you love, and don’t worry about the world and what the world’s gonna do. It’s cool even if people love one song, but if they are gonna take the journey of the album, that’s my dream. We aspire to make music in that format, but even if one person loves one song, that's still so awesome”. Yes, yes it is. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Great bands and great records shouldn't come down to a competition, but by way of bringing it to your attention, Tindersticks’ Soft Tissue was my choice of 5th best album of 2024. I’m touched that Stuart Staples seems genuinely pleased to be on the list. Alexi Petridis’ review of that record in the Guardian was so good I read it a few times. “If the overall message seems to be about noticing beauty in small things as a bulwark against the ghastliness of 21st-century life”. That captures the mood of the album in precious few words. I found myself drawn into Soft Tissue…seduced by it really. From the opening song, New World, and its topline “I won’t let my love become my weakness” it got me, and the rest of the record buried itself into my brain even though I couldn’t pinpoint why. But as Stuart Staples attests, the best music connects with us in a way that is beyond analysis: “If a record sets things off, gets you searching for something or looking for meaning, then it's doing its job. If we understand it too much, it's kind of dead, whereas if there is mystery to it, space to try and understand it, then it’s alive”. Tindersticks music is beyond analysis but that hasn’t stopped me consuming everything written about the band over the years with almost as much hunger as their music. What makes them such a well kept secret? In the book Long Players, author Eimear McBride’s essay on the second Tindersticks album (the band is rare in every sense, including the dubious accolade of being a band with two self-titled albums, the debut and its follow-up). “There’s a true, if disconcerting, magic to the three way wedding of the album’s beautiful, intricate scoring, the cigarette-stained, shame-filled intimacy of the lyrics and Stuart Staples’ deep, dark, world-weary singing voice”. If the best artists create a world in which their work can come alive and their fans can escape from the humdrum of life and the worries of the world, then Tindersticks are the perfect example. But beware those who enter, this world is not perfect and to overuse typical adjectives, it is dark and as McBride attests, disconcerting. It’s also strangely comforting. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

The Doves have yet to have a big 'moment', but in the music business of 2025, those moments no longer even exist. Instead, bands of ‘modest success’ must crack on, do their best work, put it out in the world and hope people take some notice. If, as a result, they can reconnect with fans, get out on the road, and make another record, then that is what counts as success. Carrying on regardless. But, Doves have also had success by any hard industry measure. Hit singles (two UK top 10), sold out tours and no less than a trio of number one albums (The Last Broadcast, Some Cities, The Universal Want). “Apparently we are [successful]. Apparently we are the most underrated band ever. I do have gratitude. Even though we’ve been dealt some pretty bad cards, we’re also appreciated, so that levels that one up”. And so Doves soldier on, more resilient than most bands would be in the face of such a constant stream of setbacks. That's partly due to adaptability (which other bands could sell out a tour, sans frontperson?), positive attitude and, importantly, being self-reliant. The fine new album Constellations For The Lonely is a full-scale DIY job, self-produced and released under their own label Doves Music Limited. In a world where ‘independent artists’ seem more dependent than ever on industry gatekeepers, Doves can get it done on their own. Well, almost - Constellations is distributed through the new distribution arm EMI North. Better still, the whole project is influenced by the 1982 classic sci-fi noir Blade Runner - as fine a cultural reference point as you need for escaping from the pressures of the outside world, while letting them become part of the bigger story. “When we made the album, it was 4-5 hours away from reality each day, a safe space away from all the shit. That’s what got us through it”. It’s another creative high for a band that is definitely, somehow, underrated. Yet at the heart of the band is a creative power that they can rely on, even when they operate as three or two. That’s something Jez is both confident but humble about. “I tell you who is there for us…the music. I know it sounds cheesy, but it has always been there as a constant, and a guiding light. I know that’s a cliche but cliches do have a tendency to be true”. Let’s not call Constellations For The Lonely a comeback then, but perhaps this is the start of Doves being free to go where they want, knowing that their fans will follow, that they will get some radio support, and that the recognition and critical acclaim will keep on coming. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

If the route to longevity is to be bendable into the music industry’s rules for success, The Lumineers really shouldn’t be here at all. It makes no sense. Their stripped back, rootsy ‘Americana’ (if that’s what we can call it) took hold for reasons not usually listed in the music industry rulebook. Instead, their unlikely ascendancy into the realms of being a major league band, by any measure, has happened through the real route to success: trial and error, hard graft, writing songs from the heart and performing them with vulnerability. And yes, when that led to big breaks, like supporting U2 on the massive anniversary tour for The Joshua Tree, they didn’t blow it. You don’t have to be a phenomenon but do have to be a pro. In today’s music business, you can’t phone in the work and expect a career in return. Wesley Schultz and Jeremiah Fraites have thought about it all, a lot. They know their strengths and weaknesses, their inspirations, and how to tap them. Tom Petty, Neil Young, Leonard Cohen and Radiohead are there in the mix. Indeed, you could say that The Lumineers self-awareness seems to be the real root of their ultimate success and longevity. That, and treating the work as sacred. As Fraites puts it: “Even to make one song is impossible. It’s so much work. One song is already a pain in the ass, before you talk about doing a full LP.” As Fraite’s friend and British booking agent Alex Bruford told him once “everybody wants Radiohead’s career”. And it’s a truism. The artist who doesn’t compromise creatively, can take a 180 degree turn if they want to, can meld their influences but render those as something unique to them. Artists that can call on the tradition of the song but dress it in different ways, adding something to the DNA of popular music. And do it all with success and recognition, and no need for hype. Dignity intact. It’s likely then, that a new generation of artists and bands coming up in today’s fractured and frantic music business, bands that really want success but don’t want to be moulded by the industry like plasticine, might just be telling themselves that they want a career like The Lumineers. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

This episode is brought to you in collaboration with War Child. This is a special episode of The Art of Longevity celebrating vinyl and the ongoing importance of vinyl and the album form to artists and to music fans. In this short audio documentary you’ll hear some thoughts and stories from renowned musicians like Ben Folds, Gaz Coombes, Interpol, Laura Veirs, Alela Diane, Crowded House, Eels, Ron Sexsmith, Tindersticks, Feeder, Goo Goo Dolls, John Grant and Brett Anderson of Suede. The Art of Longevity returns shortly, meanwhile please listen and DONATE to War Child NOW! Thank you for listening and donating. For more visit https://www.songsommelier.com/ Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

There are always some central pillars to a great party playlist - songs that just work. One of those is the Joan As Police Woman song Holy City. The song is always an instant hit at parties, guaranteed to elicit excitable inquiries as to “who is this?”. That instant reaction. The song is a #1 hit in my family - one of those multi-generational family life tracks. But if Holy City is instantly likeable, with a great beat and a strong poppy hook, it’s somewhat uncharacteristic of Joan’s music, which is mostly the opposite: seductive slow burns that take their time to become loved. It’s what Joan herself refers to as the eternal quandary of a life making alternative and original songs in today’s music business. “A lot of people are just really busy and they don’t have time to figure out what this incredible new music is that might require 10 listens until you’re hooked”. Then again, after some time away from Joan’s music, it was another of her singles that I was immediately drawn to, the smouldering, unhurried jazzy ballad Full Time Heist, from her new album Lemons, Limes and Orchids. This song, written as a cynical ode to one of life’s chancers, is my song of 2024 and enters into the canon of my all time favourite songs. That’s two for Joan and makes her increasingly one of my very favourite artists. Joan is the ultimate collaborator - entirely comfortable with creating in the moment no matter who she works with - and some of her collaborators have been bona fide music royalty, including Tony Allen, Rufus Wainwright and Damon Albarn (and also David Sylvian although their recording sessions have yet to see the light of day - something I only discovered after my chat with Joan). But an effective collaborator as she is, Joan makes her own records, literally. Right from the start her 2007 debut Real Life was entirely self-funded, subsequently shopped around to labels that would be willing to take it to market. She had a little bit of help for her first E.P. from - of all places an independent record shop in Derby, England. Indeed, store owner Tom Rose of Reveal Records created his own label just to get Joan’s first songs on the market. Tom happens to be Joan’s manager to this day. Going back through the catalogue, it is striking just how high the quality of Joan’s solo output is, most notably her stunning Sophomore record To Survive (2008), the ultra-cool collaboration with Tony Allen and Dave Okumu The Solution Is Restless (released during the pandemic in 2021). And now Lemons, Limes and Orchids - yet another creative high water mark for an artist whose songs have a classic, timeless quality. The obvious question is how does such an uncompromising, singula artist even survive in today’s content-flooded music business? “I practice daily to avoid the whole ‘compare and despair’. Keep the focus on myself and make the best music I possibly can and then I’m a happy person”. If she is happy, we should be too - and lucky to have her making such wonderful music. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/

Of all the bands to grace our company on The Art of Longevity, perhaps other than Suede themselves, Keane have ridden the music industry rollercoaster through all the stations of the cross: struggle, success, excess, disintegration and if you’re lucky - enlightenment. Tim Rice-Oxley doesn't hesitate for a moment: “Yeah, absolutely. Our struggle was quite long and our disintegration was quite quick, although we clung on effectively for quite a while. I feel like now we are in a more positive and exciting place than the day before Hopes & Fears came out”. It’s easy to forget in these days when the monoculture is a dot in the rear view mirror, that Keane really went huge: five consecutive number one UK albums (album six ‘Cause & Effect’ was number two). Their early success carried an unstoppable momentum. Yet behind the sheen of that success, as quickly as their second album ‘Under The Iron Sea’, the band was imploding - a combination of exhaustion and the pressure of heightened expectations causing an emotional disconnection between bandmates - a difficult thing to handle for old school friends. Every band of longevity should make a book and/or a film. It’s what fans in today’s crowded music landscape deserve really - the scarcity of access to the inner circle, whether that’s present or past. And for Keane themselves it sounds like the book has served a therapeutic purpose in a way. “We’re insanely hard on ourselves, to the point where it’s not good. We’d find any feedback and take it as a stick to beat ourselves up with. But we’re finally at a point now where we can say that we are quite good at what we do, proud of our music and our place in the world”. As Keane heads back into the studio next year, the band is far better equipped than when they headed to Sanger’s French farmhouse 20 years ago to make their debut - both emotionally and technically. The only problem is that they have set the bar high when it comes to track record. The creative ambition and self-critical muscles of this band are no doubt twitching away. “I know I’m going to have to write a lot of songs to get to the magic. One of the things bands struggle with is quality control - knowing the difference between what’s good and what’s great. There are millions of people out there trying to write songs as well so you have to raise your voice about everything else out there”. On page 35 of the book Hopes & Fears: Lyrics and History are two lists on the page of a ring bound notepad, titled The OK Computer Test. “There’s no way we thought we were making the next OK Computer but you’ve got to try. You ask yourself “how do our heroes do it”. But if we knew then what we know now, we might have put ‘Somewhere Only We Know’ at number five instead of first”. For the next Keane record I suggest they apply “The Hopes and Fears Test”, just to make sure their new material is up to scratch. Support the show Get more related content at: https://www.songsommelier.com/