DOWNTIME - interviews with dance artists & arts leaders, talking about dance & the arts

Lloyd Newson OBE is a director, dancer and choreographer. He formed DV8 Physical Theatre in 1986, and the company went on to tour across the world for decades, winning 55 national and international awards including the Prix Italia, Rose d'Or and an International Emmy Award. Shows include:, the hard hitting, physically combative, politically charged My Sex; Our Dance, Dead Dreams of Monochrome Men; poetic pieces with more of a sense of narrative and/or design - Strange Fish, Enter Achilles and The Cost of Living; and the later shows where Lloyd combined his physical languages with verbatim text - To Be Straight With You, Can We Talk About This and John. Lloyd retired in 2022 and DV8 was closed down. Some of the work is archived through Digital Theatre and the company archives are now part of the Theatre Collection at Bristol University. Lloyd and Lou spoke late in 2022 about the journey of DV8’s work, the rage and sense of injustice that drove him, whether dance can bring about social change, and how Lloyd strove to make work that ‘did what it said on the tin’. He also spoke about what he looked for in a dancer, how it wasn’t till the end of his career that he understood the support he needed in the studio, the burnout that led to him to retire in 2022 and the pleasures he is finding in life now – fishing and spending time with family and friends.

Lou talked with Italian choreographer and performer Silvia Gibraudi, sometimes referred to as ‘the prophet of the free body’, in December 2022. Silvia talked about her journey of trying to find joy and grace, and bring them to people’s lives, to theatres and to people in the street. She explained how her show Graces explores questions like ‘what is beauty?’ and ‘what does it mean to be perfect?’ in a playful, pleasurable but political way, by placing Silvia, her clown-like character and her ‘curved body’ alongside the bodies of young male virtuosic dancers. They spoke of clowning and the importance of having no fourth wall, of shame, of the joys of working with older and younger dancers, and of how, in her next show, Silvia will be exploring how to bring the inclusive feeling of a fete in a square to her audiences. Silvia also explained how in some ways she is tired of these conversations about the body, but that it seems there is still a need for it to be addressed, so address it she shall! Silvia Gribaudi is an Italian choreographer who also specialises in performing arts in general. Since 2004 she has focused her research on the social impact of bodies, having set at the centre of her choreographic language the comic element and the relationship between audience and performers. Award-winner of the Premio Giovane Danza D’Autore with her piece “A CORPO LIBERO”(2009), finalist at the Premio UBU for best dance show and finalist at the Premio Rete Critica award with R.OSA (2017), winner of the Premio CollaborAction#4 2018-2019, finalist at the Premio Rete Critica 2019, winner of the Premio DANZA&DANZA 2019 for best Italian production with the piece GRACES and Premio Histryo Corpo a Corpo 2021. She has taken part in several artistic research projects, including: CHOREOROAM (2011), TRIPTYCH (2013), ACT YOUR AGE (2014) – an EU project about active ageing through the art of dance, which inspired the performance WHAT AGE ARE YOU ACTING?, as well as the community project OVER 60; PERFORMING GENDER (2015); CORPO LINKS CLUSTER (2019/2020), where the connection of dance, the mountains, and the mountain community gave life to the site specific project TREKKING COREOGRAFICO (choreographic trekking) and to the piece MONJOUR (2021), produced by Torinodanza Festival in collaboration with Teatro Stabile del Veneto and Brussels’s Les Halles de Schaerbeek. In 2021 she has been a guest choreographer at “Danser Encore, 30 solos pour 30 danseurs”, a project for the Opéra de Lyon and in June 2023 her new production will be premiered: WHERE DOES A BALLET END? (provisional title) a coproduction by MM Contemporary Dance Company (IT), La Biennale de Lyon (FR), Théâtre de la Ville (FR), Rum för Dans (SE), Torinodanza Festival (IT), International Dance Festival TANEC PRAHA (CZ), Zodiak – Side Step Festival (FIN) and the international network Big Pulse Dance Alliance. Her shows have been featured in a number of national and international festivals and are the result of a creative process that focuses on dialogue and on the poetic encounter with other artists, dance companies, and communities.

Lou talked with Movement Directors Ayse Tashkiran and Ingrid Mackinnon about how they approach the key relationships at the heart of their work - namely directors, individual and groups of actors and other collaborators; how they try to identify and develop the ‘feeling’ or ‘colour’ of a production and how they move between leading and observing. They also shared their thoughts on how to ask for time to do the work they need to do, the practicalities that surround how often they are in the space, the visions they have for the role of movement direction in the future, and how important (and sometimes difficult) it is to bring one’s authentic self to work every day – no matter the context. As someone who works mainly in dance, but whose background is in theatre, Lou has always been fascinated by those who crossed the line in the other direction – bringing movement training to theatre. Like dramaturgs, movement directors choose to work in the murky shade – rarely needing or getting public recognition for their work, but nevertheless being thoroughly committed to the development of the craft, the art form and the artists they work with. And of course, we are all engaged in thinking about the dramaturgy of movement. Ayse Tashkiran is a movement director, teacher and researcher in the field of movement in theatre. Her work aims to free and empower the actor through motion, imagination and emotion. She act as an advocate for the field of movement direction and create links between directors, actors and movement directors. Ayse has been at the helm of the MA MFA Movement: Directing and Teaching - at Royal Central School of Speech and Drama since 2004. She is an Associate Artist at the RSC (having worked on As You Like It, The Provoked Wife, Romeo and Juliet, The Duchess of Malfi, and many more), and she’s worked on productions at Donmar Warehouse, Shakepeare’s Globe, Birmingham Rep, Theatre Royal Stratford East, The Young Vic to name but a few. She is the co-founder of the Movement Directors’ Association, the first professional body advocating on behalf of movement direction practices and conditions. Publications include her own book Movement Directors in Contemporary Theatre: Conversations on Craft – yes she literally wrote the book on it; and contributions to The Actor and His Body by Litz Pisk, and The Routledge Companion to Jacques Lecoq. Ingrid Mackinnon is a London based movement director and choreographer. Movement direction credits include work for the National Theatre of Scotland, Fuel, Kiln Theatre, Birmingham Rep; Theatre Royal Stratford East; Regent’s Park Open Air Theatre – on a production of Romeo and Juliet for which she won Black British Theatre Awards 2021 Best Choreography Award. Other credits include: Intimacy support for Antigone, 101 Dalmatians, Legally Blonde, Carousel (Regent’s Park Open Air Theatre) and Intimacy Director for Girl on An Altar (Kiln Theatre), Enough of Him (National Theatre of Scotland).

Lou spoke to Julia in November 2022. They talked about how her journey and values underpin everything she does; how important it is for her to be part of a movement that advocates for the representation of people like her; how House of Absolute work as a collective, and how she approached the role of choreographer of Cabaret at the Kit Kat Club. Julia also spoke of how, in her early days of parenthood, she is trying to have conversations she might find uncomfortable, and approach them with the same honesty and mindfulness she values in all of her work.

Hello and welcome to a rather unusual one-off episode of Downtime. Lou has absolutely loved talking to all her brilliant guests about how they approach their work. But a while ago it was suggested that maybe she make a mini- episode that focuses on her work, her personal approach to dramaturgy and also CoAD - The Centre of Applied Dramaturgy - and the courses and bursaries she’s developing. And who better to ask to hold that conversation than veteran dance critic and writer, Sanjoy Roy.

Damien and Lou spoke in mid October 2022. They talked about the interest in ritual that has informed all of his work; his collaborations with visual artists to make the pieces Thr(o)ugh, Vessel and Skid; the impact that being caught in the centre of the 2015 terrorist attacks in Paris has had on the content of his work; and what it is he is enjoying about working in film.

Caroline spoke with Lou about the work she has done, as a ‘mosquito buzzing in the ears of the arts industry’, striving for cultural equity both in the UK and Australia, and how far there is yet to go on that journey. She described the work of Arts Access Victoria, including the brilliant new Alter State Festival, and all the work they have been doing with Arts Centre Melbourne to make it a truly accessible event. Caroline also talked about the costs that come along with being an arts leader and an artist with a mountain to climb, and what’s coming next for her own work as a maker.

Tarek Iskander is the Artistic Director of Battersea Arts Centre, in London. Born in Sunderland to parents born in Egypt, Tarek moved to the Middle East when he was five, and returned to the UK at 17, escaping from the Gulf War in Kuwait. He studied engineering before beginning a management career in the NHS that lasted more than a decade. In the following chapters of his journey he was the Interim Director for Theatre at Arts Council England, one of the founders and Associate Artistic Director of the Yard Theatre in Hackney and also Resident Director at the National Theatre Studio. Since 2018 Tarek has been the Artistic Director and CEO of Battersea Arts Centre - a venue which is ‘a home for radical artistic ideas’ stemming from ‘a belief in the power of performance and collective imagination to spark positive change.’ Tarek spoke to Lou about his ideas for change with regard to the golden triangle of funders, venues and artists/freelancers, what BAC is doing to support artists in terms of exploration and risk, and what it was like to get married there, earlier this year.

Lou talked with Ned, Alan and Naomi about what motivates them, what models they use, their different approaches and what’s difficult about the work they do. They talked about how trust and time are key to letting co-created ideas emerge, and they shared top tips for anyone embarking on a participatory performance project.

Multi- award winning Sasha Waltz was born in Karlsruhe, Germany and studied dance and choreography in Amsterdam and New York. In 1993 she founded her company Sasha Waltz & Guests, together with Jochen Sandig and In 1996 together they opened the Sophiensæle, a theatre in Berlin. In the years since, alongside her work with Sasha Waltz and guests, she has been one of the artistic directors of Berlin’s Schaubühne 1999 - 2004, and she was the joint artistic director, with Johannes Öhman, of the Staatsballett Berlin for a couple of years from 2019. Among her numerous works are The Körper trilogy, noBody, Exodos, choreographic operas such as Dido & Aeneas (2005), Medea (2007), Roméo et Juliette. Sasha is currently touring the more intimate pieces In C & Kreatur, as well as a full scale opera - Orfeo Lou spoke with Sasha in late June 2022 about the evolution and dramaturgy of her whole career - how economics, opportunity and the space in which they were working has impacted the content, form and scale of the work itself. Sasha spoke about her new show ‘In C’ and how its playful, semi-improvised form speaks of the freedoms and responsibilities of living collectively in society. Sasha also spoke about the ongoing battle as a leader to find allies and make change.2 The internet wasn’t always friendly in this recording, there were a few bumps along the way, but we got there and we hope you’ll enjoy it as much as we did.

In this episode of Downtime, Lou talks with Noel Jordan – Festival Director of Imaginate and Edinburgh International Children’s Festival. They talked about Noel’s approach to programming, Imaginate’s year round support for artists, the risks Noel can take in terms of programming difficult or sensitive material, and his observations about the quality and nature of work being made both in the UK and across Europe. Noel has extensive experience as an award winning producer, director, actor-devisor and drama educator. Whilst working as a Drama Lecturer in Arts Education at the University of Melbourne, he also completed his Masters in Education. Imaginate is the national organisation in Scotland, which promotes, develops and celebrates theatre and dance for children and young people.

Lou spoke to Annabelle while she was at Jacob’s Pillow, in June 2022. They spoke about where Annabelle’s passion for working across genres comes from, the detail of how she prepares and what she asks of her dancers in the studio, and how she and her dramaturg and long time collaborator Nancy Meckler work together. Annabelle also talked about what she thinks a female choreographer can bring to female roles, and what changes she’d like to see in the programming of major companies – one of which she plans to lead one day! Colombian-Belgian, Annabelle Lopez Ochoa is an award-winning choreographer that has created around 100 works for 71 dance companies around the world. A versatile choreographer, she creates regularly within the dance field but also for theatre, opera, and musical theatre. Her wide-ranging body of work includes short conceptual pieces, full-length narratives and dance films. She completed her dance education at the Royal Ballet School of Antwerp and after a 12-year long career in a number of European dance companies, Annabelle decided in 2003 to focus solely on choreography.

Jonzi D is the founder and Artistic Director of Jonzi D Projects and Breakin’ Convention the international Hip Hop festival he founded in 2004 with Sadlers Wells. A dancer, spoken word artist and director, he is the foremost advocate for hiphop theatre who has changed the profile and influenced the development of the UK British hip-hop dance and theatre scene over the last two decades. He has been actively involved in British hip hop culture, rapping and b-boying since its genesis. As well as making his own work, with shows such as The Letter in 2013, which he made about his decision to turn down an MBE, and TAg … Just writing in my name 2006, and the more recent film We Want Our Bodies Back he is passionate, as we will hear, about supporting the work of other artists, and the development of Hip Hop theatre as a whole. In fact his most recent role is as Artistic Director of The brand new Hip Hop Theatre Academy – which opens at the new Sadlers Wells East venue in 2023. Lou spoke to Jonzi in May 2022, and they talked about the changes he has seen across the years of Breakin Convention; his hopes for the new Sadler's Wells Hip Hop Academy and the philosophy of 'Each one teach one' – that informs his own life, and the Hip Hop sector more widely.

New York based Katy Pyle is a genderqueer lesbian dancer and choreographer who founded their dance company Ballez in 2011 to explore their complicated relationship to the cis-hetero patriarchal form of ballet, and to make space for their own, and their communities’, presence within it. The mission is to reimagine ballet through collaborative, community-minded, and antihierarchical approaches. Katy is working to insert the herstory and lineage of lesbian, queer and transgender people into the ballet canon through the creation of large-scale story ballets, open classes, and public engagement. Major works include “The Firebird, a Ballez,” which has a lesbian princess and a “tranimal”—part bird, part prince), “Sleeping Beauty & the Beast,”which you’ll hear all about later in the episode, and most recently "Giselle of Loneliness," staged in 2021. As a dancer Katy has appeared in the works of Ivy Baldwin, Faye Driscoll, Xavier Le Roy, Karinne Keithley Syers, Jennifer Monson, StinaNyberg and many others. Lou spoke to Katy when they were in New York in May 2022. Wetalked about Katy’s journey in, out and back in to ballet, their refusal to bow to the traumatic oppression and limitations of the ballet world, and their realisation that they didn’t have to change themselves – they could change ballet instead. https://www.ballez.org https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/theater_dance/ballez-katy-pyle-giselle-of-loneliness/2021/06/01/23f9897c-bfd0-11eb-b26e-53663e6be6ff_story.html

Joseph Toonga is from East London. He makes and performs dance productions that tell stories of the under-represented, relevant to the here and now which are embedded in the languages of contemporary dance and Hip Hop. Joseph is Artistic Director of Just Us Dance Theatre, has created work for Edge; National Youth Ballet of Germany; Richard Alston Dance Company and Junior Ballet Madrid. He is also co-founder of Artists 4 Artists and recently became The Royal Ballet’s first Emerging Choreographer. Lou talked to Joseph in April 2022 about his commitment to finding, making and sharing space; his desire to create dance in numerous contexts in order to tell the real stories of the under-represented; and the challenges of forging a path in new contexts that don’t yet feel like home. http://www.justusdancetheatre.com

Born in Havana in 1973, Carlos Acosta trained at the National Ballet School of Havana in Cuba. After winning a succession of awards, including the Prix de Lausanne in 1990, he went on to dance professionally with the world’s most prestigious ballet companies, including The Royal Ballet, English National Ballet, Houston Ballet and Cuban National Ballet company. Carlos retired from classical ballet in 2016, after 28 years, having performed almost every classical role from Spartacus to Romeo. He is the Artistic Director of his own company in Cuba- Acosta Danza, he runs the Carlos Acosta International Dance Foundation, has written a novel and an autobiography, of which the movie Yuli was made. He received a CBE in 2014, the Queen Elizabeth II Coronation Award from the Royal Academy of Dance in 2018, and in 2019 the Critics’ Circle Annual Award for Outstanding Services to the Arts. in January 2020 Carlos Acosta became Director of Birmingham Royal Ballet, and in February 2021 – he spoke to me.

Michael Keegan-Dolan founded Teaċ Daṁsa in 2016 as a means to forge stronger connections with the native traditions, language and music of Ireland, as exemplified by the company’s first two productions, Swan Lake / Loch na hEala (2016) and MÁM (2019). Previously Michael was AD of Fabulous Beast Dance Theatre creating three Olivier Award-nominated productions: Giselle, The Bull, and The Rite of Spring. Giselle won an Irish Times Theatre Award and The Bull won a UK National Dance Award. In this really entertaining conversation, Lou spoke to Michael about his resistance to many of the expectations and models of the entertainment industry, and how his belief that ‘what will be will be’ has led him not only to live the life he wants to live and make the work he wants to make in the way he wants to make it – but also to cope with this period of uncertainty with a philosophical shrug, a laugh and a willingness to accept whatever life throws at him.

Lou's guest on Downtime today is Shobana Jeyasingh, an internationally recognised choreographer who founded Shobana Jeyasingh Dance 30 years ago. She has created over 60 critically acclaimed works for stage, screen, and public spaces such as Palladian monasteries, fountain courtyards and city offices. In addition to her work with SJD she has also been commissioned by Rambert Dance Company, Ballet Black, Wayne McGregor/Random Dance, Beijing Modern Dance Academy and many more. Shobana is the recipient of numerous awards including the Woman of the World Award in 2017 and a CBE in 2020. Shobana and Lou met virtually in the mid-summer heat of August 2020. They talked about the almost eery prescience of her 2018 show Contagion; the process of making SJD Shorts – a series of digital films released during Covid; making work in, of and from the edges and some fascinating ideas around women’s and dispersed narratives...

Lou's guest on Downtime today is Swedish choreographer, film maker and dancer Pontus Lidberg. Pontus became Artistic Director of Danish Dance Theatre in 2018 . He has also been commissioned by Paris Opera Ballet, New York City Ballet, Martha Graham Dance Company, Les Ballets de Monte-Carlo, Acosta Danza, Balletboyz and Beijing Dance Theatre. Lou joined Pontus virtually (sadly!) in his wooden hut on a lake in Sweden on July 31st 2020. They talked about his work as a film-maker and a choreographer, and the opportunities inherent in each form, and Lou made him answer some pretty niche questions about the term ‘abstract narrative’(!) They also discussed his role as Artistic Director of Danish Dance Theatre and his hopes for the 'relevance' of dance in the future.