Clean Clothes Podcast

The half hour episode explores how organisations in different countries from across the Clean Clothes Campaign network supported workers in the time of COVID. In this episode, we hear how: Plus thoughts and reflections on the impact of COVID on worker organising. Please share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org Speakers: Laura Stefanut, campaigner and former investigative journalist, Romania Anton Marcus, Joint Secretary of FTZ&GSEU (Free Trade Zone and General Services Employees Union), Sri Lanka Kalpona Akter, Executive Director of BCWS (Bangladesh Center for Workers Solidarity) Bego Demir, Clean Clothes Campaign, Turkey Christie Miedema, Clean Clothes Campaign International Office, Netherlands Mandy Felicia, EILER (Ecumenical Institute for Labor Education and Research), Philippines Host: Febriana Firdaus (febrianafirdaus.com) Sound Engineering Support: Steve Adam (www.spectrosonics.com.au) Producer: Matthew Abud Clean Clothes Podcast Team: Anne Dekker, Johnson Ching-Yin Yeung, Liz Parker, Tanne de Goei Full Transcript HOST Welcome to the first episode of the first series of the Clean Clothes podcast. I’m Febriana Firdaus. As this episode is being produced, we’ve all heard terrible news out of Myanmar, with the military overthrow of the elected parliament. From all of us on the podcast, and certainly everyone in Clean Clothes, we want to express our solidarity and support to everyone from our network in Myanmar. And to all the people of that country who stand for democracy, and for human rights and the rights of workers. We’re also sending our solidarity to my co-host, Manny Maung – she’s completely caught up now, in the response to the military coup. We’ll have more to say from Clean Clothes, at the end of the show. We know that under COVID, brands have cancelled orders and refused to pay for completed work. Many suppliers have cut wages and fired workers, who have far too often also been excluded from social safety nets and other support. In Romania one worker, Angelica Manole, protested against her wage cut. Laura Stefanut is a former investigative journalist there, who got involved in the campaign. She tells the story. LAURA Angelica is a brave worker who spoke about the fact that she was only paid about one hundred and forty Euros for one month’s work. Each day she worked at least eight hours a day and she was paid like about half the minimum legal wage in Romania. So she spoke about this on Facebook. I believe she was the first garment worker that was so outspoken and so open to speaking to journalists and to Facebook friends. That’s how we found out. The company Tanex where Angelica was working, they’re among the biggest garment factories in Romania. Certainly they’re a famous factory. They were actually in the past they were trying to attract workers by saying that they pay more than other factories because as you probably know, in Romania workers are only paid the minimum wage, they work extra hours many times unpaid, the living wage is way above the legal minimum wage here so we’re talking about people who work but stay poor. At the factory what they did when the inspection went there, they said that she didn’t work actually. So basically they lied, they said that she didn’t come to work. But then you know it was a public scandal, I mean I helped her write some complaints to the Ministry of Labour, to the worker inspection, I also myself wrote complaints. I also contacted the Labour Ministry in Romania directly by phone and I was promised that things would be resolved and somehow they were, I mean there was another inspection which found the first inspection was wrong, and actually the factory did not register any absence of the worker, she was obviously there. So they fined the factory. Angelica was fired by Tanex. So even having all the national media’s attention on you, even having strong figures who are taking...

What does it take to make the workplace safe for women, free from sexual harassment and gender-based violence? What are some of the ways women have won improvements, and how did they build their power to do this? In this episode: Please tell us what inspired you about this show, and share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org Speakers: Dian Septi Trisnanti, founder of FBLP union (Federasi Buruh Lintas Pabrik) , Chairperson of KPBI union, Indonesia Motheba Ramaema, shop steward, National Clothing, Textile and Allied Workers Union, Lesotho Sam Mokhele, General Secretary, National Clothing, Textile and Allied Workers Union, Lesotho Rola Abimourched, Senior Program Director at the Worker Rights Consortium, USA. Rukmini Vaderapura Puttaswamy, President of Garment Labour Union (GLU), Bangalore. Priscilla Robeldo, campaigner and lobby and advocacy coordinator with CCC Italy. Sina Marx, Coordinator International Projects and Campaigns, FEMNET, Germany. Host: Febriana Firdaus (febrianafirdaus.com) Field Reporter: Harsha Vadlamani Interpreter: Kaveri Sound Engineering Support: Steve Adam (www.spectrosonics.com.au) Producer: Matthew Abud Clean Clothes Podcast Team: Anne Dekker, Johnson Ching-Yin Yeung, Liz Parker, Tanne de Goei Full Transcript DIAN: When we built our union in 2009, most of us, the officers, are women. And we have the same vision for the equality and also fight against GBV. We have method in organise women workers as women. HOST: That’s Dian Septi Trisnanti, one of the founders of the Forum Buruh Lintas Pabrik union, or FBLP in Indonesia. Welcome to episode two of the Clean Clothes podcast. I’m Febriana Firdaus. This time, we’re talking women workers – about the violence and harassment they often endure And some ways of building power and fighting back. In 2014 Dian’s union joined with other organisations, to promote women’s rights in a large industrial park in North Jakarta, Indonesia. DIAN: There are two union, one women’s organisation, and Jakarta Legal Aid, become one alliance in the women worker committee, to struggle against GBV, gender based violence. We have two programs, the first program is to install warning board that the industrial park is free from Gender Based Violence or sexual harassment. HOST: The warning board was a large sign that announced the industrial park was a zone free of gender-based violence and harassment. It was part of a strategy to raise the profile and awareness of this as an issue for workers. And of course, as a warning to any perpetrators. DIAN: The industrial park, KBN Cakung, in North Jakarta, agreed to install the warning board in 2016 on November, it’s the international day against women violence. HOST: Dian also directed a documentary film, Angka Jadi Suara, which followed this effort. The film shows the effort behind the campaign. This included lobbying the management of the industrial park, and the Ministry of Women Empowerment and Child Protection. At the centre of the film though, is the workers – and the sexual harassment and gender-based violence they experience. DIAN: There were one person, one woman, who want to tell the story. This women, my friend yeah, she has a trauma. The interview takes about five hours and we have to stop about one hour just to give her time to stop and then take a breath and then take a break. And after that I asked to her if she want to stop then we will stop. But she said that she will not stop because if not now, then when? And after the documentary finish the first person that we give the edited version is her. HOST: The documentary had a number of public screenings, and media coverage. It took the story beyond the industrial park, to a bigger audience. The voices of women workers, are at the centre of the union’s efforts. In 2012 they established community radio station Marsinah FM. The station is named after...

In this episode, our contributors reflect on laws and regulations for holding brands and retailers accountable for violations of worker rights in the factories that supply them, including: Please tell us what inspired you about this show, and share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org Speakers: Nayla Ajaltouni, Coordinator, Collectif Ethique sur L’Etiquette, France Nasir Mansoor, General Secretary, NTUF (National Trade Union Federation), Pakistan Muriel Treibich, Lobby and Advocacy Coordinator, Clean Clothes Campaign International Office, Netherlands Scott Nova, Executive Director, Worker Rights Consortium, USA Hostfebrianafirdaus.comSound Engineering Support:www.spectrosonics.com.auCourt of the Future performers: www.freetheatre.com.auProductionPodcast Team:Full Transcript JUDGE: Order! Order! I mean it – I will have order in this court! Now then. To the defendant. Mr. Ralph Hermes Vuitton You may deliver your statement. RHV: Thank you, Your Honour. May I say with great humility, I’m humbled by the privilege to address this court. Very humbled. Humblingly so. Because as everyone knows, we at Ralph Vuitton are a humble, ethical, caring, socially responsible, innovative brand ...and we pay record dividends! The simple fact is – we didn’t know! And our promise is – we will do better! We can’t know everything our suppliers do. It’s unrealistic. We have thousands of them! We change them all the time! Some employees even work from home. Are we supposed to visit them too? I mean, what would happen to my exclusive trench coat in those neighbourhoods? It would be ruined. JUDGE: Order! Come on now, let’s have a little order here. Right. Now Mr. Vuitton. Please keep to the point. RHV: Yes your Honour. To put it simply. Did we make the building a fire trap with no escape? No, we didn’t. Did we ban the workers from organising together or cut their pay? No, it wasn’t us. Can you blame me that women are constantly harassed in the workplace? That’s outrageous! Let me finish with this point. Your Honour, could I say how stylish you would look in a bold red Faux Leather Coat. For you, it would be an affordable 175 Euros. But if we had to pay for all the things they propose? Why, it could go up to 176! We’d be bankrupt! Thank you, Your Honour. JUDGE: And why are you giving me your business card, Mr Vuitton? RHV: Just if you are interested in that Faux Leather Coat. JUDGE: This is not a sales pitch, Mr. Ralph Hermes Vuitton. We’re in a court of law. Do you understand? HOST: Could that be the court-room of the future? Where brands must prove that they take care of human rights, through their whole supply chain? I’m Febriana Firdaus. Welcome to episode three of the Clean Clothes Podcast. Today we talk human rights due diligence, and making laws to keep brands honest. Human rights abuse includes stolen wages, sexual harassment, and union busting. It has also cost many workers their lives. This is Nasir Mansoor, General Secretary of the National Trade Union Federation or NTUF in Pakistan. NASIR: There was a tragedy in September 2012, where in a factory there was a fire and 260 workers died in that factory. And that factory was producing merchandise for a German brand, its name was KIK. So when we look into the law, even Pakistani law, European law, German law, we didn’t get any space for the workers to go for filing of a case and make them accountable for it. So in that context we get to know that we should have, not only in Pakistan but also in European Union there would be some kind of a law or some kind of a mechanism to make them account for. Unfortunately after filing a case in Dortmund against KIK in German court, after three years of hearings, the court verdict that on technically on Pakistani laws it was a time bar issue. HOST: The push for human rights supply chain laws, has a long history. Trade Unions and...

How can we get fair pay in workers’ pockets, and replace poverty wages with a real living wage? What new tools can our campaigns use? In this episode: Please tell us what inspired you about this show, and share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org If you want to know more about the Europe Floor Wage, including its methodology, you can find that here, and in even more detail here. Speakers: Host: Febriana Firdaus (febrianafirdaus.com) Field Reporters: Petra Ivsic and Aca Vragolovic Sound Engineering Support: Steve Adam (www.spectrosonics.com.au) Producer: Matthew Abud Clean Clothes Podcast Team: Anne Dekker, Johnson Ching-Yin Yeung, Liz Parker, Tanne de Goei Full Transcript TOLA: Even the law, even the convention of ILO, mention that people working 8 hours per day and they should, they should be entitled to the decent living standard with human dignity. We talk with the workers, no single worker work, in our experience work only 8 hour per day and then enjoy with the decent living standard. Visibly we see that they have to force themselves to work overtime. Even you are not well enough, you are sick. And then if you just complain, you just make the complaint, they may frame up you with any criminal cases in the courts. So this is happening. So wage for me, as I said, it’s a key issue that put the people into the modern-day slavery. Forced labour. They don’t lock you by the key but they lock you by the system. HOST: That’s Tola Moeun, founder of the worker rights NGO CENTRAL in Cambodia. Today we’re talking about workers’ pay. How to use data to make the reality of poverty wages transparent. And ways to campaign for a living wage. TOLA: The supplier always say we cannot pay higher living wage or minimum wage because the brand just pay them low price, but we don’t know how much the brand paid to the supplier because the business agreement between the brand and the supplier is quite confidential, so it is not transparent enough and then the brand does not disclose, even some brand do not disclose their supply list so we don’t know, and then the brand make an excuse saying ok they do not have much leverage to pressure their supplier because they have a small percentage of order either from the country or either from the individual factory. The business agreement between the brand and the supplier, should be transparent. We know that some information they should hide, but I think the export country should also consider about the ethical information act, so the brand will not be free in terms of providing a fake information to the consumers or to its own government in terms of the situations of the workers where they’re producing the clothes. I know that in Norway for example they had introduced already the ethical information act, which hold their business or private sector be accountable in providing the accurate or real information to consumers, transparency in terms of throughout the supply chains. HOST: Welcome to the show. I’m Febriana Firdaus. Making supply chains more transparent, is a key campaign tool. The fashionchecker.org website, is a step towards this. It matches brands with their supplier factories, so consumers and campaigners, can see where clothes are made. But this does not show factory conditions, including how much suppliers pay their workers To try and change this, a recent Fashion Checker project began collecting worker wage slips in several countries. Anne Bienias is from the Clean Clothes Campaign’s International Office. ANNE: We can’t just go out and campaign and ask for brands to pay something because they will always say they’re already doing that, or that it’s not as bad as we’re saying. So we need real data, we need real evidence to show that we are right and that workers have the right to earn more. So it might seem like just a small part, but it’s very important for our credibility also as a...

Formalise It! Rights for All Workers How can we expand rights to all garment workers, no matter where they work – in factories or their own homes, or as refugees or migrants far from their country of origin? In this episode: Please tell us what inspired you about this show, and share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org Speakers: Host: Febriana Firdaus (febrianafirdaus.com) Field Reporters: Petra Ivsic and Aca Vragolovic Sound Engineering Support: Steve Adam (www.spectrosonics.com.au) Producer: Matthew Abud Clean Clothes Podcast Team: Anne Dekker, Johnson Ching-Yin Yeung, Liz Parker, Tanne de Goei Full Transcript HOST: Welcome to the show, in our second instalment of the Clean Clothes Podcast. I’m Febriana Firdaus. Today we’re talking about rights for all workers – meaning migrant workers. Refugee workers. Home-based workers. Workers who might not have all the right documents, or who might be hidden from view. Sometimes governments and employers, don’t see them as workers at all. But they still demand their rights. Mae Sot is in Thailand near the Myanmar border. Refugees and migrant workers from Myanmar, have lived there for decades. Now it has hundreds of garment factories that depend on migrant workers. They’re often underpaid to an extreme degree. The Kanlayanee factory there made clothes for famous brands: Starbucks, Disney, NBC Universal, and Tesco. In 2019 the workers demanded their proper pay. Brahm Press takes up the story. And just a note: Kanlayanee is the name of the factory, and the name of the factory owner as well. BRAHM: My name’s Brahm Press, the Director of MAP Foundation. MAP Foundation started in 1996, and one of the things we do is we have a process of developing peer leaders, and other migrant worker leaders, identify people who are potential leaders, give them training, and eventually even have passed some through paralegal training. So these workers are able to organise other workers, so that they can collectively bargain with employers for improved working conditions. In 2019, we invited a reporter from Reuters to Mae Sot to look at the issue of underpayment of wages to migrant workers in factories, and found workers from the Kanlayanee factory. Everyone was being underpaid and there were massive labour rights violations going on. And this developed into a story mainly because these factories were producing for American brands. Soon after that, the factory closed once Starbucks withdrew its order. So out of the 50 workers around half decided they wanted to take their case for redress, they wanted to make claims for unpaid back wages, unpaid overtime including working on days off and holidays. This group as it turns out, had also passed through some paralegal trainings that MAP had provided so they were very active and very aware of their rights. Kanlayanee wanted to negotiate with the workers, and so she started negotiations at around half a million Baht, and there were a couple of rounds of negotiation but it was unsatisfactory. So that was around the time that we decided that maybe we should look at the brands. MAP, CCC and WRC, Worker Rights Consortium, worked together along with our community partner CBO, known as Arakan Workers Organisation. The factory owner actually put up pictures of all the workers who were part of the claims, and said do not hire these people, basically put out a blacklist and everywhere they went they found that they were not accepted even though they have obviously extensive experience in garment factories. A lot of them stayed together and they were sharing food which included foraging for like bamboo shoots and morning glory and other things that were just available in the jungle or on the roadside and then eat that with the rice. So it was difficult. So finally in August or September the court ordered Kanlayanee to pay thirty per cent of the total, or...

Industries around the world including the garment sector have to change if we’re going to survive the climate and ecological crisis. How can we make sure that worker and community rights are at the centre of this change? In this episode: Please tell us what inspired you about this show, and share your feedback, comments and questions, by emailing: podcast@cleanclothes.org Speakers: Host: Febriana Firdaus (febrianafirdaus.com) Field Reporters: Petra Ivsic and Aca Vragolovic Sound Engineering Support: Steve Adam (www.spectrosonics.com.au) Producer: Matthew Abud Clean Clothes Podcast Team: Anne Dekker, Johnson Ching-Yin Yeung, Liz Parker, Tanne de Goei Full Transcript HOST: Welcome to the Clean Clothes Podcast. In today’s show we’re talking about a Just Transition. It’s a big conversation. KARIN: We believe that the systemic crisis are interconnected, be it the climate crisis, biodiversity crisis, water crisis, food crisis, and now the pandemic. So if we all want to overcome this crisis, this systemic crisis we face, we really need the people’s movements, people’s organisations, to come together. HOST: It’s about how we need to build a better world, if we want to survive in the future. And about what that means for the rights of all workers. URSKA: I mean in general we’re talking about one of the most polluting industries on the planet, synonymous with over-consumption, pollution, increasing waste crisis, but also exploitation of workers in the global supply chains HOST: And what the Clean Clothes Campaign Network needs to do. TIBBE: To have a consciousness about the environmental issues, climate issues, it’s still quite a new thing. And I think it really is a challenge for us as a Network now to understand what are these implications for workers, and what are the responses that we propose and what is it that we imagine a Just Transition looks like HOST: You just heard from several of our guests – we’ll meet them all again, later in the show. I’m Febriana Firdaus. The challenges of climate and ecological crisis are profound. But in many ways, we’re still working out what it involves for workers. How do we transition from the current business model to one that is good for workers and the environment? In mainstream debates a lot of the talk is about a just transition in the energy sector. Often Just transition is seen as something for the energy sector to carry out. We need to change the energy sector – but we also need much more than that This episode is about starting some of that discussion. With people in the Clean Clothes Network, and with others outside it. Right now, a Just Transition can have different meanings for different movements. But the campaigns will be stronger, if these meanings are connected. If the understanding is shared. How do we make that happen in our own countries, and our own places of work? Rochelle Porras is Executive Director of EILER, Ecumenical Institute For Labor Education and Research in the Philippines. ROCHELLE It’s true, we have to really transition into a low-carbon economy otherwise we won’t have a planet to live in, the production system is absolutely not sustainable as of the moment. But I guess the problem lies in the implementation of the programs that the country-level policies when we talk about Just Transition. First and foremost Just Transition in developing countries like the Philippines receive less attention because the energy industry is still is facing the very basic of problems such as you know, many of our areas still don’t have electricity. So it’s mind-blowing for us to talk about these technological advancement when the very basic, you know we need electricity to run things, something as basic as that, we don’t have it yet. Likewise the Philippine energy industry’s also guided by privatisation, liberalisation, and so no public ownership. And renewable energy industries are primarily...

Welcome to the Clean Clothes Podcast. In this series we’ll look at the challenges, strategies, and gains of the Clean Clothes Campaign. We’ll share the stories and reflections of members from across the network. We'll begin full publication in January 2021.