Holding the Fire: Indigenous Voices on the Great Unraveling

Dahr Jamail speaks with Dilafruz Khonikboyeva about how people can live through collapse while maintaining their core identities and values. Dilafruz also reminds us how Indigenous people have always had a symbiotic relationship with Earth, living as one with and being in love with Earth. Dilafruz Khonikboyeva, an Indigenous Pamiri from Tajikistan, is a transformational conflict expert, who has focused her work on civil wars, climate and resource conflicts, and storytelling. She is the inaugural Executive Director of the Home Planet Fund, the latest tool in the Patagonia philanthropic ecosystem.

Dahr Jamail talks with Dr. Lyla June Johnston and gains a far broader perspective on the polycrisis. Lyla June wonders why people are surprised that things have arrived at this point of collapse, given the inherent insatiability of the dominant system of extraction and growth, and the fact that Indigenous people have been issuing warnings for centuries. She also discusses rebirth, consequences of our actions, the creation of new paradigms, the Lakota view of selfishness as a mental illness, gardening our culture, healing, and ultimately, love. Dr. Lyla June Johnston, of Navajo, Cheyenne, and European lineages, received her PhD from the University of Alaska Fairbanks’ Indigenous Studies Program, with a focus on Indigenous land stewardship. She also has a degree in environmental anthropology, with honors, from Stanford University, and a degree in American Indian education, with distinction, from the University of New Mexico.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Dr. Yuria Celidwen about how we must find true belonging and true community with both humans and the more-than-human world. Yuria discusses a broader statement she created that she calls “the ethics of belonging,” which encourages awareness, intention, relational well-being, and actions towards planetary flourishing. She also talks about spirit medicine, why she is not fond of the word "hope," dreaming, non-linear time, and much more. Dr. Yuria Celidwen, a native of Nahua and Maya descent from Chiapas, Mexico, has been conducting research that combines the vibrant threads of Indigenous studies, cultural psychology, and contemplative science. Yuria is a senior fellow at the Other and Belonging Institute at the University of California, Berkeley.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Shoba Liban about the importance of persevering with our work to serve our communities, no matter the results and no matter how difficult things become. Shoba also discusses the great importance of building community resilience, local farming, and adapting to the impacts of the worsening climate crisis. Shoba Liban, a Boorana woman from Kenya, is the founder and CEO of the entirely women-run Pastoralist Women, an NGO that promotes health and education for women and children in Kenyan pastoralist communities. Caution for listeners: please note that Shoba discusses extreme violence against women, which can be difficult to hear.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Alson Kellen to hear about how his people survived nuclear testing on their home islands, colonialism, imperialism, and how they are now navigating the climate crisis. Alson discusses how he believes traditional values present the best hope for a sustainable future for his people, as well as for all of us. Alson Kelen, a native of Bikini Atoll, is one of the world’s few masters in the ancient art of wave-piloting. Alson is an authority on traditional ocean canoe construction and navigation, and has done much to perpetuate Marshallese culture and traditional knowledge among the younger generations where he lives.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Paty Gualinga about her people’s spirituality and interconnectedness with the Amazon Rainforest, and the ancient prophecies of her ancestors which are coming true today. She also talks about how, after a decade-long fight she helped lead, Ecuadorians recently voted decisively to end oil drilling in the Amazon in their country. Paty Gualinga is an Indigenous rights defender and foreign relations leader of the Kichwa People of Sarayaku, an Indigenous community based in the Ecuadorian Amazon.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Sam Olando about the challenges his people have faced, over generations, as governments and/or corporate projects displace increasing numbers of people from their ancestral lands. Sam also discusses Indigenous values, the importance of community, and the functional nature of reciprocity. Sam Olando, a Luo man from Kenya, is a human rights defender and community organizer who is the executive director of Pamoja Trust, an NGO dedicated to promoting access to land, shelter, and basic services for the vulnerable.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Celine Lim about the gap that exists between living in her Indigenous world of connectivity, and the so-called modern world of city life where she works. She discusses her grief that stems from that gap, what is lost when she experiences disconnection from her Indigenous roots, kinship, and activism. Celine Lim is an Indigenous Kayan leader from Sarawak, a Malaysian state on the island of Borneo. Celine is the manager of Save Rivers, a grassroots organization that highlights the impacts of destructive logging in Borneo’s forests and Indigenous territories.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Galina Angarova about grieving what is happening on Earth, and what it was like being raised within an intact Indigenous culture. She also discusses the critically important role of ancestors and intergenerational trauma, and reminds us that the traditional knowledge of Indigenous people that came directly from the land itself is our only hope for a future. Galina Angarova is a Buryat woman from the Lake Baikal region of Siberia. In addition to being the Executive Director of Cultural Survival, an Indigenous-led NGO that advocates for the rights of Indigenous peoples around the world, Galina is a climate and land rights activist.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Aslak Holmberg about how the Great Unraveling has always been the inevitable result of an ideology built on unsustainability. Aslak also provides his stark assessment of the dominant global paradigm of constant growth, as well as an inspirational message of standing firm in our work for the planet, no matter what. Aslak Holmberg is an Indigenous Saami who lives on the Deatnu River, on the border of Norway and Finland. He is serving as the President of the Saami Council and works on various processes dealing with Indigenous knowledge, rights, and biodiversity conservation. He is also a salmon fisher, teacher, and holds a masters degree in Indigenous studies. Aslak is also a former member of the Saami Parliament of Finland.

Dahr Jamail speaks with Anne Poelina about the root cause of the cascading environmental and social crises of the 21st century: the Western industrialized, extractivist mindset. Anne also presents ideas for changing our perspectives and perceptions to be in community with nature, and the importance of listening to Indigenous voices. Anne Poelina is a professor and chair of Indigenous Knowledge at the University of Notre Dame Australia, as well as the chair of the Martuwarra Fitzroy River Council.

Dahr Jamail discusses how he came to seek out Indigenous leaders for ideas on how to navigate the climate emergency and related environmental and social crises of our times. He highlights the importance of listening to Indigenous voices and introduces the people who will be sharing their wisdom in future episodes. Dahr Jamail is an award-winning journalist and author of several books, the most recent he co-edited with Stan Rushworth, We Are The Middle of Forever: Indigenous Voices from Turtle Island on the Changing Earth.