Lessons I Learned in Law

Pola Karolczyk, General Counsel and Chief People Officer at Cowboy, joins Scott to share her dynamic legal journey: from competition law in Poland and US law firms, to regulatory work at Apple, and now building the legal and people functions at a fast-moving e-bike scaleup. Pola reflects on three powerful lessons, beginning with the need to ditch legal jargon and speak human. She learned early on that most people, especially in business, aren’t interested in the mechanics of the law, just the outcome. This mindset has shaped her ability to communicate clearly, deliver pragmatic advice, and influence senior stakeholders across borders. She also highlights the importance of developing leadership and commercial skills outside the comfort zone of technical legal work, drawing on her experiences in Big Law, Apple, and now Cowboy. Pola’s final lesson is one for ambitious lawyers: if you want to lead, don’t wait for calm conditions. Join a scaleup, stretch yourself, and learn on the edge. Now wearing dual hats in legal and HR, Pola offers rare insight into what it means to shape culture and governance in parallel, and why reporting directly to the CEO matters. Guest Recommendation: • Podcast: Impact Theory with Tom Bilyeu - Practical strategies for personal and professional growth About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone navigating the leap into leadership. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone navigating the leap into leadership.

Tara Haig, General Counsel at Multiverse, joins Scott to reflect on a legal career driven by curiosity, courage, and instinct. From saying yes to opening a New York office two years post-qualification to leading legal, privacy, and governance for one of the UK’s most prominent edtech scale-ups, Tara’s story is all about leaning into discomfort, and figuring it out along the way. Now part of the exec team at Multiverse, a $1.7B AI-powered apprenticeship platform, Tara shares her take on three big lessons: embracing stretch opportunities (even when terrifying), understanding the commercial engine behind your business, and showing up with authenticity. Whether it’s tackling GDPR in lockdown, raising a SPAC, or managing legal complexity across Series A to D growth, she’s built a legal career that’s anything but linear. This episode is a must-listen for anyone navigating scale-up chaos, growing their team, or trying to stay grounded while building something big. Tara also shares candid reflections on working from Kenya, raising twins, and why perspective, and permission to say no, is as important as saying yes. Guest Recommendations: • Book: Invisible Women by Caroline Criado Perez • Podcast: Pivot with Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway • Podcast: The Rest is Politics About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with a lawyer navigating the scale-up world.

Shelley McKinley, Chief Legal Officer at GitHub and Vice President at Microsoft, joins Scott to share career-defining lessons from two decades at the sharp edge of tech, innovation, and regulation. Now leading GitHub’s global legal, policy, and trust teams, Shelley offers a behind-the-scenes look at the early days of GitHub Copilot, launched before ChatGPT put generative AI on the map, and shares what it really means to advise on emerging technology when the law hasn’t caught up yet. She talks candidly about navigating ambiguity, making smart bets in fast-moving industries, and how the best legal advice can’t be given in a vacuum. Shelley’s lessons cover how to lead in-house teams with the right mix of legal and non-legal expertise, how to focus on high-impact work in a sea of meetings, and why building strong internal networks is a non-negotiable skill for modern legal leaders. Her reflections are sharp, grounded, and refreshingly honest, touching on everything from grunge music to paralegal strategy, Microsoft’s legal transformation, and the FUD-to-FOMO evolution of AI. Guest Recommendations: • Podcast: Acquired — Particularly the Spotify and Microsoft episodes • Book: The Meditating Mother by Laura Kopchick — A quirky short story collection written by Shelley’s college friend (https://www.amazon.com/Meditating-Mother-Laura-Kopchick/dp/1962148157) About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone curious about leading in tech, AI, or global legal teams.

Sam Plant, Chief Legal Officer at Müller UK & Ireland, brings a refreshing mix of humility, insight and honesty to this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law. From risk-taking in legal advice to speaking up about gender inequality, Sam shares three candid lessons that challenge the status quo. Leading the legal and compliance function across one of the UK’s best-known consumer brands—yoghurts, milk, desserts, and a vast B2B logistics network—Sam reflects on a career shaped as much by mistakes as by milestones. He explains why embracing the right kind of mistake can sharpen commercial judgement, and why lawyers who never get it wrong may be playing it too safe. Sam also offers a counterpoint to the classic “say yes to everything” career advice. In his view, learning to say no—to roles, responsibilities, and scope creep—is essential for long-term success and team wellbeing. In a standout third lesson, Sam shares how he became more aware of his own privilege and began advocating for gender equity in law and beyond. His honest reflections on male allyship, everyday bias, and building trust with women in the profession are as powerful as they are practical. Guest Recommendations: • Book: Doppelganger by Naomi Klein • Podcast: Origin Story by Ian Dunt and Dorian Lynskey About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with a colleague—especially those who want to lead with empathy, courage, and clarity.

David Flavell, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary at PepsiCo, shares practical, hard-earned insights from a legal career that has spanned the globe—from Melbourne to Shanghai, Dubai to New York—culminating in one of the most senior legal roles in the Fortune 50. Now leading a global legal function of 500+ professionals, David speaks candidly about how in-house lawyers can step into a more strategic mindset. He explains why legal leaders must go beyond technical skill and embrace being seen as commercial operators—riding potato trucks (literally), working side-by-side with business teams, and asking the questions no one expects lawyers to ask: “How’s the business doing?” David unpacks what it really means to be a strategic partner, how to balance legal risk with business ambition, and why “being liquid and filling the gaps” is one of the most valuable habits a legal leader can develop. From navigating cultural differences to crisis management and AI readiness, this episode is packed with practical guidance for lawyers who want to lead, not just advise. About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with someone navigating global legal leadership.

Jorrit de Haan, General Counsel and Corporate Secretary at Mollie, joins Scott to share the honest highs and hidden challenges of building an in-house legal function from the ground up. Jorrit stepped into his first GC role at Mollie in 2021, tasked with transforming a handful of lawyers working reactively into a fully-fledged legal team. In this conversation, he shares the leadership lessons he’s learned along the way—starting with the golden rule that you can’t spend too much time on hiring. From trusting your gut when bringing people in, to protecting team culture and avoiding the “department of no” trap, Jorrit lays out what it really takes to build a trusted, high-performing legal function in a fast-paced fintech. He also opens up about his own career path—from private practice to interim roles—and why it took trying a few things before landing in the GC seat, the role that fits him best. Along the way, you’ll hear why Harlan’s Razor (“never attribute to malice what you can attribute to incompetence”) has become one of his guiding leadership principles. About Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with a colleague navigating their own in-house leadership journey.

Roel Staes, until recently General Counsel International at FedEx, joins Scott to reflect on a 22-year in-house legal career that scaled from Benelux counsel to overseeing a 500-strong international legal, regulatory, security, and government affairs team. In this wide-ranging episode, Roel shares candid lessons from the top—on everything from managing complexity in global organisations to learning how to communicate with clarity, brevity, and precision. A strong believer in over-communication and having your “memory card” ready, Roel explains why lawyers need to proactively articulate their value, insert themselves into business conversations, and take ownership beyond the job description. He also makes a compelling case for win-win lawyering, drawing from hard-earned lessons negotiating contracts and managing sensitive relationships. Plus, Roel introduces us to the concept of healthy laziness—why challenging processes, improving systems, and questioning the status quo is a key trait of high-performing in-house lawyers. Whether you're aiming for GC, growing a legal team, or just trying to become a sharper operator in-house, this episode is packed with sharp, actionable takeaways from someone who’s walked the walk across global legal leadership. Guest Recommendations: Emotional Intelligence HabitsWhat Every BODY Is SayingLa Voix du RAIDAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with someone thinking about long-term growth in-house.

Emma Moloney, experienced General Counsel and in-house leader across media and tech, joins Scott to reflect on a career that has spanned continents, contracts, and crises. From early GC roles at National Geographic Channel and News UK, to launching crisis management workshops and mentoring lawyers, Emma’s journey blends legal leadership with creative problem-solving. In this episode, Emma unpacks the lessons that have shaped her approach. She shares why mastering difficult conversations is a non-negotiable skill for leadership, why least-worst decisions are sometimes the hallmark of senior roles, and how embracing no jobs for life can foster resilience and career longevity. Along the way, she discusses the value of contracting roles to build diverse experiences, her work in crisis preparedness (with a few juicy anecdotes), and why getting comfortable in the grey areas is key to thriving in-house. This one’s packed with practical advice and candid reflections for any lawyer navigating leadership, transitions, or the uncertainties of modern work. Guest Recommendations: Brené BrownThe Rest is HistoryAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Found this episode valuable? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave us a review, or share it with a colleague who’s plotting their next career move.

Jane Hyde, Group General Counsel and Company Secretary at RWS Group PLC, shares a refreshingly non-linear legal career that took her from City law to investment banking, via a sabbatical in wine tasting — all the way to the executive team of a global AI-enabled language services business. In this unfiltered episode, Jane reflects on the pivotal moments that shaped her leadership journey. From leaving Freshfields for the trading floor at JP Morgan, to taking a career break and topping the global wine diploma charts, Jane’s path is anything but typical. Her lessons emphasise the value of learning outside law, the importance of clear, human communication (especially in a tech-heavy world), and why ownership and accountability matter more than ever for in-house lawyers. Listeners will take away practical insight on integrating legal with the wider business, contributing meaningfully to executive discussions, and building credibility through sound judgement—not just technical skill. Jane also shares how side roads, like compliance and PSL roles, helped refine her leadership approach, and why your next move doesn’t always need to be part of a five-year plan. Guest Recommendations: The Rest is HistoryThe Rest is EntertainmentAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law, leave a review, or share it with someone navigating their next legal career move.

Daniel Winterfeldt, General Counsel for EMEA and Asia at Jefferies, shares his powerful journey from Wall Street to London and from capital markets partner to in-house legal leader and diversity champion. In this candid conversation, Daniel opens up about his early experiences as an openly gay lawyer navigating the stark culture shock of moving from New York to London in the early 2000s — a time when being out in the legal profession was far from the norm. This culture gap eventually led him to found the Interlaw Diversity Forum, a not-for-profit organisation driving inclusion, equity, and culture change in the legal sector for the past 17 years. Daniel’s lessons are deeply human and widely applicable: the importance of putting people first in any legal function; how knowing what you don’t know is just as important as what you do; and why every problem has a solution — even if it’s not the one you expected. This episode is packed with insight for anyone navigating leadership, career growth, or the structural challenges of the legal industry. Daniel also shares details of Interlaw’s Inclusive Recruitment Toolkit — a free, open-source guide every hiring manager should read — and some great podcast recommendations to expand your thinking. Guest Recommendations: The Rest is Politics: USBlow UpRevisionist HistoryAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities. 🎧 Enjoyed this episode? Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law on your favourite podcast platform, leave us a review, or share it with a colleague.

Lessons I Learned in Law with Amos Carrington, General Counsel & Company Secretary at Low Carbon Amos Carrington, General Counsel at Low Carbon, talks to Scott Brown about making the leap from private practice to leading a mission-driven renewable energy legal team. In this episode, Scott catches up with Amos Carrington, General Counsel at Low Carbon, a fast-growing renewable energy company. Amos shares practical, candid lessons about trusting your instincts, prioritising workplace culture, and seeing feedback as a gift. He reflects openly on his transition from Herbert Smith Freehills—including his pivotal secondment in Tokyo—to leading an expanding in-house legal team through Low Carbon’s scale-up journey. Amos highlights why culture and mission alignment have been essential to his career fulfilment and shares personal insights from his time abroad and his passion for music. A great listen for anyone at a career crossroads looking for genuine insights into in-house leadership. Amos’s Recommendations: Podcast:The Age of LongevityBook:The LoraxAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.

Mike Sosso, EVP for Legal at BP, joins Scott Brown to discuss his transition from specialist competition lawyer to strategic global leader of a 400-strong legal team. In this episode, Scott welcomes Mike Sosso, Executive Vice President for Legal (Group GC) at BP, overseeing a global legal team of over 400 professionals. Mike shares candid insights into his journey from an antitrust specialist to one of the most senior legal roles at BP, highlighting how curiosity, allyship, and commercial thinking shaped his leadership style. Mike’s three powerful lessons focus on embracing curiosity over certainty, becoming genuinely commercial in approach, and proactively owning your career path. He openly discusses how stepping outside his comfort zone and seeking opportunities beyond his specialist background transformed his career trajectory, moving from deep subject expertise to strategic leadership roles across multiple business areas within BP. Highlights from the conversation include Mike's reflections on the realities of leading a global team, the practical steps he recommends for lawyers aiming to become more commercially minded, and how a pivotal mentorship conversation changed his perspective on career growth. Mike also addresses the importance of allyship and diversity, sharing his personal experience as one of the few openly gay General Counsels at a global corporation, and how active allyship across different communities has influenced his leadership approach. Mike closes the conversation with insightful recommendations: Mike’s Recommendations: Book:The Boys in the BoatPodcasts:Wait Wait… Don’t Tell Me!Ten Percent Happier with Dan HarrisAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.

In the final episode of Season 6, Scott Brown is joined by Katja Roth Pellanda, Group General Counsel at Zurich Insurance. Katja shares her journey from a corporate law associate to managing a global legal function of 500+ lawyers. Her story is a masterclass in career growth, highlighting how being visible, strategic, and vocal can elevate your career. Key Lessons from Katja: Visibility Matters: Learn to Market Yourself: Transforming Leadership: Standout Moments: Katja’s Recommendations: Book:Reimagining Capitalism in a World on FirePodcast:RethinkingAbout Heriot Brown: At Heriot Brown, we help lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Beyond recruitment, we foster a thriving community of in-house legal professionals who share insights, experiences, and growth opportunities.

In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, we welcome Aki Hussein, a seasoned legal professional turned founder / entrepreneur. As Chief Legal Officer and Co-Founder of TerraPay, Aki shares his unique journey from Big Law to the bustling streets of Nairobi and eventually to founding an international payments company. His career exemplifies the intersection of law and entrepreneurship, showcasing how legal expertise can drive impactful innovation. We delve into how lawyers can harness their training to succeed beyond traditional roles, with actionable insights for legal professionals considering a shift in their career paths. Key Lessons from Aki: Focus on the Fruit Flies: Aki shares how small, seemingly insignificant experiments in life can teach profound lessons. Bet on Yourself: Aki encourages legal professionals to trust their instincts and take calculated risks. Drawing from his decision to co-found TerraPay, he highlights how betting on oneself opens doors to creativity and professional growth. Love vs. Fear: Aki reflects on how decisions are often rooted in either love or fear. He challenges lawyers to overcome fear-driven mindsets and embrace opportunities for growth and connection. This is real practical advice for lawyers considering non-traditional career paths, including the importance of incremental steps and self-reflection. Book and Podcast Recommendations from Aki: Book: High Output Management by Andy Grove – A tactical guide to systems thinking and team optimisation. Podcast: The Professor G Podcast by Scott Galloway – An engaging resource for understanding complex topics like AI and market trends, with a dose of humour and practical insights. About Heriot Brown: Lessons I Learned in Law is brought to you by Heriot Brown, the in-house legal recruitment specialists dedicated to helping lawyers find fulfilment in their careers. Our mission extends beyond job placements, fostering a vibrant community that connects legal professionals with valuable insights and opportunities. Subscribe & Share: Subscribe to Lessons I Learned in Law on your favourite podcast platform to stay updated on the latest episodes. If you enjoyed this conversation, please leave a review or share the episode with your network on social media. Your support helps us bring more inspiring stories to the legal communities

In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Scott Brown is joined by Nick Raymond, General Counsel for Corporate and Group Functions at Swiss Re, one of the world’s largest reinsurers. Nick shares his unique career journey from private practice at Clifford Chance to leading a global team at Swiss Re, spanning legal functions like M&A, ESG, asset management, and more. Nick’s reflections on embracing opportunities, lifelong learning, and prioritising team dynamics offer valuable insights for lawyers navigating career growth and leadership challenges. Listen in as Nick discusses: The Role of Luck and OpportunityLearning from SetbacksThe Power of Teamwork and FunKey Takeaways: Ride Your LuckContinuous LearningHave Fun Along the WayMentioned in the Episode: Podcast RecommendationThe Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie SantosBook RecommendationsLessons in ChemistrySapiens: A Brief History of HumankindWhether you’re curious about what it takes to lead a large in-house legal function or seeking career advice on stepping outside your comfort zone, Nick’s journey provides practical and inspiring insights for legal professionals at all stages of their careers.

In this episode of Lessons I Learned in Law, Scott Brown is joined by Anoop Joshi, Chief Trust Officer at Trustpilot. Anoop's unique career journey from private practice to leading trust, transparency, and legal operations for one of the world’s leading review platforms offers insights for any lawyer looking to break new ground. With a background that blends law, tech, and business, Anoop shares the key lessons that have shaped his approach to legal practice, leadership, and career growth. Listen in as Anoop discusses: Whether you're curious about the evolving role of legal leadership in the digital age or seeking practical advice on career management, Anoop's journey is filled with valuable takeaways for any legal professional. Key Takeaways: Project Management as a Career SuperchargerKeep Your Eyes on the HorizonStick to Your PrinciplesBringing Tech to LawThe Chief Trust Officer RoleLinks Mentioned in the Episode: Connect with Anoop Joshi on LinkedInThe Personal MBA by Josh KaufmanLex Fridman Podcast

This week on Lessons I Learned in Law, Scott Brown sat down with Sandrine Auffret, Executive Vice President, Chief Legal Counsel, and Company Secretary at ASML. Sandrine invited Scott to ASML’s podcast studio on their impressive Eindhoven campus—a city with a rich legacy in tech and innovation. Sandrine’s journey from healthcare law to tech is packed with insights. She’s been leading ASML’s legal team as it grew from 37 to over 100, all while adapting to one of the most rapidly evolving industries in the world. They dive into what it takes to lead legal in such a high-stakes environment, her approach to balancing growth and well-being, and why staying curious has been her superpower. Key Takeaways: Adapting to New Challenges:Building a Strong, Strategic Legal Team:Authenticity in Leadership:Navigating Cultural Shifts:Preparation and Resilience:

In this episode of 'Lessons I Learned in Law', Scott Brown interviews Kelly Young, General Counsel and Executive Director at Marie Curie, one of the UK's biggest charities. Kelly shares her journey from private practice to in-house counsel, emphasising the importance of authenticity, curiosity, and understanding risk and governance in the legal profession. She discusses her role in building teams and navigating challenges in getting to that position, while also providing practical advice on personal development and setting oneself up for success in a demanding career. If you're considering a transition from private practice to in-house, you won't want to miss this episode!

On this week’s show, Scott Brown is joined by David Lancelot, Chief Legal Officer and EVP for Advocacy at LawVu. With over 20 years of experience building and optimising international in-house legal teams, David is a real leader in legal innovation. In this episode, they explore his career journey—from traditional legal roles to his work at LawVu, a company transforming legal operations through technology. David shares insights on the evolving landscape of in-house legal functions, highlighting the need for modernisation and a shift in mindset. They discuss how legal teams are moving from risk management to becoming key business partners, and the importance of aligning your career with what really motivates you. They also cover leadership, managing teams, and how legal operations can help scale efficiency. David’s advice on networking, self-reflection, and embracing non-traditional career paths—such as privacy or legal operations—are just some of the key takeaways from this engaging conversation. If you’re interested in the future of in-house law and want to hear from someone shaping the industry, this is an episode you don’t want to miss!

On this week's show, I am joined by Chantelle Zemba, Group General Counsel at Deliveroo. Chantelle falls into the category of someone who was a relectant in-house lawyer. She was seconded to Deliveroo to help out with some fundraising and corporate matters whilst she worked at Norton Rose Fulbright. At that time she was a self confessed deal junkie Corporate Lawyer! She joined them full time in the Corporate team shortly after and admits she has never looked back...nor had the time to do so!! The amount she has covered in her 10 years working with and advising Deliveroo is quite incredible. In our conversation, Chantelle talks about leading Deliveroo’s legal team through its $2 billion IPO, and what she’s learned along the way. Her three key lessons? Be the person who gets things doneSimplify complexityStep into others’ shoesChantelle also reflects on the challenges of moving from private practice to in-house, the value of mentorship, and what it takes to thrive in the ever-changing world of tech. If you’re interested in leadership, creativity in law, and making things happen, don’t miss this episode!