Pitchfork Economics with Nick Hanauer

This week Nick & Goldy are joined by Heather Boushey, Chief Economist for President Biden's Invest in America Cabinet, for a deep dive into the transformative economic policies of the Biden administration. Boushey discusses the paradigm shift towards a middle-out economic approach to crafting economic policy and the impact of legislation like the American Rescue Plan, CHIPS Act, Bipartisan Infrastructure Law, and Inflation Reduction Act. Their conversation explores the importance of investing in infrastructure, clean energy, and manufacturing to drive growth and create good jobs. They also discuss the challenges of implementation, the success of the administration’s industrial policy, and its remarkable economic outcomes including record low Black unemployment, high new business applications, and equitable wage growth. Even though this episode was recorded before President Biden announced he was withdrawing from the presidential campaign and endorsing Vice President Harris, this wide-ranging conversation offers plenty of valuable insight into the past, present, and future of middle-out economics. Heather Boushey is a distinguished American economist who specializes in economic inequality and public policy. She serves on President Biden’s Council of Economic Advisers and is the Chief Economist for the Invest in America Cabinet. Before joining the Biden Administration, she was the co-founder and President of the Washington Center for Equitable Growth, a research organization dedicated to advancing evidence-backed ideas and policies that promote economic growth and reduce inequality. Twitter: @HBoushey Further reading: Invest.gov The Productivity–Pay Gap Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Nobel Prize-winning economist Joseph Stiglitz joins Nick and Goldy to talk about his new book, "The Road to Freedom: Economics and the Good Society.” Stiglitz challenges the orthodox economic theories that have shaped our understanding of capitalism and argues for a new approach called progressive capitalism. Stiglitz also discusses the flaws of neoliberalism, popular misconceptions about freedom, and the widespread benefits of addressing issues like climate change and inequality. He shares insights on the need for a broader set of economic policies that prioritize the well-being of all people, not just the wealthy. Their discussion sheds light on the evolving landscape of economic thought and the hope for a more equitable and sustainable future. Joseph Stiglitz is a Nobel Prize-winning economist and the best-selling author of multiple books on economics. He was also chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers under President Clinton and chief economist of the World Bank. He now teaches at Columbia University and is chief economist of the Roosevelt Institute. His latest book, The Road to Freedom: Economics and the Good Society, delves into the failures of the neoliberal economic model and presents a comprehensive critique of how "free" markets have led to various crises, including financial instability, inequality, and social unrest. Twitter: @JosephEStiglitz Further reading: The Road to Freedom: Economics and the Good Society More from Joseph Stiglitz: People, Power, and Profits: Progressive Capitalism for an Age of Discontent For Good Measure: An Agenda for Moving Beyond GDP Globalization and Its Discontents Revisited: Anti-Globalization in the Era of Trump The Price of Inequality Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy talk to Doyne Farmer, a renowned physicist and mathematician, to discuss his new book, "Making Sense of Chaos: A Better Economics for a Better World." Farmer, who is a professor at the Institute for New Economic Thinking, challenges traditional orthodox economic frameworks by applying complex systems theory. Their conversation explores the limitations of mainstream economic models, the importance of incorporating uncertainty into economic thinking, and the potential for complexity economics to provide better guidance for policymakers in addressing pressing issues like climate change and inequality. It’s a thoughtful discussion that explores more effective approaches to understanding and managing complex economic systems. Doyne Farmer is a renowned physicist and mathematician who is currently a Professor at the Institute for New Economic Thinking at the University of Oxford and the Director of the Complexity Economics program. He is also an author known for his groundbreaking work in the field of complex systems and chaos theory. His recent book, "Making Sense of Chaos: A Better Economics for a Better World," delves into how chaos theory can be applied to understand and address the complexities of modern economic systems. Twitter: @doyne_farmer Further reading: Making Sense of Chaos: A Better Economics for a Better World Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy talk to Katharina Pistor, a legal scholar and professor at Columbia Law School, about her book "The Code of Capital: How the Law Creates Wealth and Inequality.” Pistor sheds light on how the law shapes the distribution of power and wealth in society. They explore the way that law's prioritization of capital has changed over time and its contribution to rising economic inequality within and between nations. Pistor also explains how we can reconfigure the legal playing field to address economic inequality. Katharina Pistor is a legal scholar and author known for her expertise in the fields of law and finance. She is currently the Edwin B. Parker Professor of Comparative Law at Columbia Law School, where she also serves as the Director of the Center on Global Legal Transformation. Pistor has published extensively on topics such as property rights, financial regulation, and the role of law in shaping economic systems. Her most recent book, "The Code of Capital: How the Law Creates Wealth and Inequality," explores the ways in which legal systems around the world have been designed to benefit capital owners and perpetuate wealth inequality. Further reading: The Code of Capital: How the Law Creates Wealth and Inequality Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Goldy and Paul talk to Chandra Childers, a senior policy and economic analyst at the Economic Policy Institute and author of their recent report on the Southern economic development model. Although the Southern economic development model is touted as a business-friendly strategy, it has devastating consequences for workers and families in Southern states. Childers explains how this economic model is rooted in racism and economic exploitation and has led to lower wages, weaker safety nets, and fewer opportunities for workers. They also discuss how some Southern states are bucking this trend and attempting to adopt more progressive policies, as well as the potential impact of renewed unionization efforts in the region. Chandra Childers is a senior policy and economic analyst with the Economic Analysis and Research Network (EARN) at the Economic Policy Institute. Her work is primarily focused on supporting EARN’s state and local policy research and advocacy network in the Southern United States. Before joining the EARN team at EPI, Childers was a Study Director at the Institute for Women’s Policy Research. Twitter: @ChandraChilders Further reading: Breaking down the South’s economic underperformance The evolution of the Southern economic development strategy Rooted in racism and economic exploitation Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy are joined by political scientist Brian Judge, author of "Democracy in Default: Finance and the Rise of Neoliberalism in America." They delve into the historical roots of our current democratic crisis, exploring the role of liberalism in depoliticizing distributive conflicts and paving the way for the rise of neoliberalism. Judge sheds light on the impact of neoliberal ideologies on American policymaking and how liberalism's attempts to manage distributive conflict through the market have shaped our economic and political landscape—which gave leaders the opportunity to use the economic slowdown of the 1970s to install neoliberal policies that enriched the wealthy few for decades. Brian Judge is an author and policy fellow at the Center for Human-Compatible Artificial Intelligence and the Berkeley Roundtable on the International Economy at the University of California, Berkeley. He is recognized for his recently published book, "Democracy in Default: Finance and the Rise of Neoliberalism in America," which delves into the intricate relationship between finance and politics in shaping the neoliberal economic landscape in the United States Twitter: @realbrianjudge Further reading: Democracy in Default: Finance and the Rise of Neoliberalism in America Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

After decades of slow and cautious movement, the Federal Trade Commission has suddenly kicked into overdrive. You’ve likely seen headlines about the FTC challenging corporate mergers and monopolies, loosening Big Tech’s chokehold on our digital lives, and fighting power imbalances that favor big corporations over American consumers. Elizabeth Wilkins, former Chief of Staff and Director of the Office of Policy and Planning at the FTC, joins Nick and Goldy to give a status update on the FTC's renewed focus on competition and broader antitrust enforcement, and to explain how the historical evolution of the agency has led to a lack of regulation and oversight in maintaining fair competition and consumer protection. Elizabeth Wilkins is an expert in consumer protection and competition policy and a newly minted Senior Fellow at the American Economic Liberties Project. Previously, she was the Chief of Staff to the Chair and Director of the Office of Policy and Planning at the Federal Trade Commission. Before joining the FTC, Wilkins served as Senior Advisor to White House Chief of Staff Ron Klain. Twitter: @ewwilkins Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy are joined by Pulitzer Prize-winning columnist David Leonhardt to discuss his latest book, Ours Was the Shining Future: The Story of the American Dream. They discuss the relationship between academic economics and the forces that sought to dismantle the mid-century consensus that promoted shared economic growth in the post-World War II era. Leonhardt shares anecdotes from his extensive research, highlighting what lessons from the past could guide us toward a more equitable future. David Leonhardt is a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist and columnist for The New York Times, where he writes its flagship newsletter, “The Morning.” He has also been the newspaper’s Washington bureau chief, an op-ed columnist, a staff writer for The New York Times Magazine, and the founding editor of “The Upshot.” Twitter: @DLeonhardt Further reading: Ours Was the Shining Future: The Story of the American Dream New York Times: Why Are Republican Presidents So Bad for the Economy? The Great Exception: The New Deal and the Limits of American Politics Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy have a wide-ranging conversation with Jason Furman, who served as Chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers under President Obama. Furman brings a wealth of experience to the discussion, which covers America’s post-pandemic recovery, the global inflation crisis, and reviving industrial policy. He also provides insight into the overall impact of President Biden's policies on the broader economic landscape. Jason Furman is a prominent economist who served as the Chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers under President Obama from 2013 to 2017. He is currently a Professor of the Practice of Economic Policy at the Harvard Kennedy School and a Senior Fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics. Furman is known for his expertise in economic policy, particularly in the areas of tax policy, healthcare, and labor markets. Twitter: @jasonfurman Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy are joined by Whitney Airgood-Obrycki from the Joint Center for Housing Studies at Harvard University to discuss the urgent issue of housing affordability in the United States. Despite its status as the wealthiest country in the world, America is grappling with a housing crisis, marked by record-high levels of homelessness and a growing number of individuals spending between 30% to 50% or more of their income on rent. Together, they unpack the housing affordability crisis, discuss how it contributes to the perception of a struggling economy, and explore the innovative solutions local governments are proposing to address it. Whitney Airgood-Obrycki is a Senior Research Associate at the Joint Center for Housing Studies at Harvard University. She conducts research on affordable rental housing for low-income households and served as the project manager and lead author of their recent report on America’s Rental Housing. Dr. Airgood-Obrycki's latest research includes affordable housing policy, housing affordability measures, rental housing markets, and suburban neighborhood change. Twitter: @airbrycki, @Harvard_JCHS America’s Rental Housing 2024 Montgomery County has found a way to reinvigorate public housing in America What if public housing were for everyone? Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy sit down with Rohit Chopra, the Director of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, to explore the agency's efforts to lower financial costs for working Americans. From cracking down on credit card late fees to tackling medical debt on credit reports and regulating bank overdraft charges, Director Chopra sheds light on the CFPB's various initiatives to promote transparency and competition in financial products and services. Chopra argues that by advocating for consumer rights and protections, the CFPB is shaping a more equitable economic landscape for all Americans. UPDATE: This episode was recorded before yesterday’s breaking news that a Texas judge issued a last-minute order temporarily blocking the CFPB’s plan to cap credit card late fees. Find more information about the injunction, and the Chamber of Commerce’s case against the cap, here: https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/11/business/credit-card-late-fees-regulation-cfpb/index.html Rohit Chopra is the Director of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB), a federal agency dedicated to protecting consumers in the financial marketplace. Prior to leading the CFPB, he served as a Commissioner at the Federal Trade Commission, where he focused on promoting fair competition and protecting consumers from deceptive practices. Twitter: @chopracfpb, @CFPB Further reading: www.consumerfinance.gov Submit a complaint about a financial product or service CFPB Bans Excessive Credit Card Late Fees, Lowers Typical Fee from $32 to $8 Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Even though the American labor market is currently stronger than it has been in decades, earlier this year Big Tech companies were laying off workers at an alarming pace. Economists struggled to understand why some 25,000 tech workers were losing their jobs, even as the media panicked about whether those layoffs were a warning sign of an oncoming recession. University of Washington Professor Jeff Shulman joins us to uncover the real reasons behind Big Tech’s layoffs, and to explain their implications for workers. Jeffrey Shulman is a professor at the Foster School of Business at the University of Washington. He’s also a podcaster and filmmaker with a diverse range of expertise in pricing, entrepreneurial marketing, and product management. As a professor, he is known for his innovative research and teaching methods that delve into the intricacies of economic principles and their practical applications in the business world. Recently, Shulman has gained recognition for his insightful commentary on the highly publicized layoffs in the tech industry. More from Professor Shulman: Nearly 25,000 tech workers were laid off in the first weeks of 2024. Why is that? Why widespread tech layoffs keep happening despite a strong U.S. economy How To Succeed In Product Management on Apple Podcasts How To Succeed In Product Management on Spotify Seattle Growth Podcast on Apple Podcasts On The Brink: A Film via PBS Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Journalist Nick Romeo joins us to discuss his new book "The Alternative: How to Build a Just Economy." Romeo argues that the conventional economic wisdom has fostered political and economic instability, resulting in widening inequality, environmental degradation, and the exploitation of workers. He also highlights innovative solutions and success stories—including worker cooperatives, public-option marketplaces, and job guarantee programs— that paint a picture of how we can design systems in a market economy that truly work for everyone. Nick Romeo is a journalist, critic, and essayist who has spent years covering policy and ideas for The New Yorker magazine. He also teaches at the Graduate School of Journalism at UC Berkeley. The Alternative: How to Build a Just Economy The New Yorker: Nick Romeo Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This week, Nick and Goldy sit down with ethics professor Ingrid Robeyns to discuss her groundbreaking new book, Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth. Robeyns challenges the idea that it’s acceptable to allow extreme wealth concentration and inequality to persist, advocating instead for a hard cap on wealth accumulation. Nick and Goldy navigate the moral and practical implications of wealth limits on society, democracy, and ecological sustainability. Ingrid Robeyns is a distinguished scholar and Professor of Ethics of Institutions at Utrecht University, and author of the new book, Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth. Professor Robeyns’ research in the field of Ethics and Political Philosophy focuses on issues of justice, inequality, well-being, and the ethical dimensions of societal structures and policies. Twitter: @IngridRobeyns Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

This special episode of Pitchfork Economics features a live conversation from the "Redefining the Center: How to Make Middle-Out Economics the New Mainstream" conference hosted by Democracy Journal in Washington, D.C. Heather Boushey, a member of the White House Council of Economic Advisors, joins Nick for a wide-ranging discussion moderated by Michael Tomasky, editor of Democracy Journal. Hanauer & Boushey explore the policy initiatives being pursued by the Biden administration that prioritize working families and promote economic growth from the middle out and discuss the crucial role of the middle out as a paradigm shift in how people think about economic cause and effect. This dynamic and thought-provoking discussion was a great start to an outstanding conference. Heather Boushey is an economist and policy advisor who serves as a key member of President Biden's White House Council of Economic Advisors and Chief Economist for the President’s Invest in America Cabinet. Prior to joining the Biden administration, she was the President and CEO of the Washington Center for Equitable Growth, a think tank focused on advancing evidence-based policies to reduce inequality. In her role in the White House, she plays a crucial role in shaping economic policy and advising the President on issues related to labor, income inequality, and economic opportunity. Twitter: @hboushey46 Further reading: The Middle-Out Moment Is Here Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

In the shadows of corporate greed and exploitation lies a sinister crime that is silently perpetrated, leaving countless victims in its wake—a crime that affects millions of hardworking Americans every year and sucks billions out of our economy —Wage Theft. No industry is immune to this insidious crime, from restaurant workers to construction laborers. On this episode of Pitchfork Economics, we are joined by Terri Gerstein, Director of the Labor Initiative at NYU Robert F. Wagner Graduate School of Public Service, to unpack the chilling truth behind these workplace crimes, learn who the perpetrators are, and uncover how they get away with it. Most importantly, what can be done to stop them? Terri Gerstein is the Director of the NYU Wagner Labor Initiative, at NYU’s Robert F. Wagner Graduate School of Public Service, which explores and helps activate the often-untapped potential of government in safeguarding and advancing workers' rights. Previously, Terri enforced labor laws in New York for 17 years, including as Labor Bureau Chief in the New York State Attorney General’s Office. Crime music bed by Power Music Factory News clips from CBS News, CBS Miami, and CBS Philadelphia Twitter: @TerriGerstein NYU Wagner Labor Initiative Further reading: Prosecute Bad Bosses: More district attorneys are cracking down on abusive employers. It's about time Report mentioned in the episode from the National Coalition Against Insurance Fraud: The Costly Crime and Impact of Workers’ Comp Premium Fraud The Role of State Attorneys General in Protecting Workers’ Rights Report: How district attorneys and state attorneys general are fighting workplace abuses More states should follow new Colorado policy on wage theft Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Preston Mui, Senior Economist at Employ America, recently authored a report titled "The Dream of the 90s is Alive in 2024: How Policy Can Revive Productivity Growth." The report offers a blueprint for policymakers seeking to emulate the successes of an unparalleled period of productivity in the United States. Mui joins us to examine and reflect on the policy decisions which drove the strong productivity growth of the 1990s, and he also identifies dynamic new strategies for revitalizing American production in the present. Preston Mui is a Senior Economist at Employ America, a macroeconomic policy research and advocacy organization committed to achieving and sustaining full employment outcomes. Twitter: @PrestonMui Three Motivations for Interest Rate Normalization: A Playbook for Fed Policy in 2024 The Dream of the 90's is Alive in 2024: How Policy Can Revive Productivity Growth Preston Mui's thread on the “Dream of the 90's” series and report by Employ America Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Today, Arin Dube, Professor of Economics at the University of Massachusetts Amherst, joins us to discuss his latest research, which suggests that the American labor market is undergoing a remarkable transformation. The widespread wage inequality that rapidly expanded between 1980 and 2019 is finally reversing, and American paychecks are growing again—especially at the bottom end of the income scale. In this enlightening conversation, Dube explains how and why the labor market has changed, how that's affecting wages, and how it all contributes to a virtual cycle of middle-out economic growth. Arin Dube is a Professor of Economics at the University of Massachusetts Amherst, well-known for his expertise in labor economics and public policy and his groundbreaking empirical research on minimum wage. His work often involves empirical analysis and utilizes large-scale datasets to provide evidence-based insights into the effects of various policy interventions. Dube's research has been widely recognized and cited, contributing to the ongoing discussions among policymakers and economists around labor market dynamics and policy design. Twitter: @arindube The Unexpected Compression thread https://twitter.com/arindube/status/1724147807563477440 NBER Working Paper https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w31010/w31010.pdf Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

In his State of the Union Address, President Biden made it clear that taxes and tax policy were his next big target for a middle-out makeover. However, we can't talk about the future of taxes without discussing the potential expiration of Trump’s’ 2017 tax law. Samantha Jacoby, a senior tax analyst at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, joins us today to help us understand the repercussions of Trump's tax policies and the opportunities ahead. Trump’s tax law was marketed as a boon for every working American, promising an average annual benefit of $4,000. But Jacoby unveils the true economic reality behind the Trump tax law: the primary beneficiaries were the wealthiest individuals and corporations; they did not pay for themselves as promised; and despite the trillions of tax giveaways to people at the top, most Americans saw no tangible economic benefit. Samantha Jacoby is a Senior Tax Analyst with the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. Before joining the Center in 2018, she practiced tax law at two international law firms in New York and Washington, D.C. Previously, she worked as a policy and research analyst at the Solar Energy Industries Association, where she focused on the impact of tax incentives on the renewable energy industry. Twitter: @jacsamoby The 2017 Trump Tax Law Was Skewed to the Rich, Expensive, and Failed to Deliver on Its Promises https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/the-2017-trump-tax-law-was-skewed-to-the-rich-expensive-and-failed-to-deliver IRS Funding thread by Samantha on Twitter https://x.com/jacsamoby/status/1752088112291807298?s=20 After Decades of Costly, Regressive, and Ineffective Tax Cuts, a New Course Is Needed Bipartisan Senate Action Passes Minimal Test for IRS Funding While Multiple House Republican Bills Fail https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-tax/after-decades-of-costly-regressive-and-ineffective-tax-cuts-a-new-course-is Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer

Eleven years ago, Democracy Journal released a special issue on "The Middle Out Moment" that explored the implications of what was then the brand-new theory of middle-out economics. The moment may not have fully arrived back in 2013, but no doubt it's here now. So this week, Democracy Journal is publishing a follow-up edition called "The Middle Out Moment Part Two," marking the fact that what was once a new idea has now gone mainstream. In this episode, we'll hear from several of the economists, researchers, and former administration officials who contributed to the special issue as they explore how middle-out economics has been put into practice — and discuss the work that lies ahead as middle-out economics becomes the new mainstream. Guests include: Felicia Wong, Bharat Ramamurti, Tara McGuinness, Sandeep Vaheesan, Todd Tucker, Ronnie Chatterji, Neale Mahoney, and Heidi Shierholz The Middle-Out Moment is Here: https://democracyjournal.org/category/magazine/72 Twitter: Michael Tomasky - @mtomasky Felicia Wong - @FeliciaWongRI Bharat Ramamurti - @BharatRamamurti Tara McGuinness - @taradmcguinness Sandeep Vaheesan - @sandeepvaheesan Todd Tucker - @toddntucker Ronnie Chatterji - @RonnieChatterji Neale Mahoney - @nealemahoney Heidi Shierholz - @hshierholz Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Twitter: @PitchforkEcon Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Nick’s twitter: @NickHanauer