Success Beneath the Surface

What a magnificent top 10 list! From Joe Leo on birthing a company to Joe Grace, who births audiences for companies, we've got Torey Carter-Conneen on inspiring unity and focus by simplifying complexity. And then, of course, there's James Hyman, who's made a successful career as a serial turnaround CEO. He balances accountability and empowerment within his teams to make progress. Topping it off is Kyle Buckett, a retired U.S. Navy SEAL who has lived up to the importance of culture improvement and fit in creating elite teams. This is the stuff not from people who write books, although several have written books, but from people who have created or transformed and ultimately lifted teams and companies to new levels. I'll warn you, they don't make it sound easy, but they do share what drove them. Pick an episode on a relevant topic and listen in as they dive in. Several common themes emerge across these episodes of Success Beneath the Surface: James HymanJoe LeoKyle BuckettTorey Carter-ConneenJames HymanJoe Leo'Torey Carter-ConneenJoe GraceDeborah FellJoe GraceJames HymanJoe LeoThese themes collectively emphasize the multifaceted nature of leadership and success in various business contexts, from startups to large organizations, across different industries. You can find the full playlist here >

CEOs are often laser-focused on destinations—quarterly targets, market share goals, and exit strategies. But what if the true measure of leadership lies in valuing the journey as much as the endpoint? This insight comes from a recent conversation with Bob Rhoda, CEO of Hemasonics, who emphasizes the fulfillment of embracing daily experiences. As someone who regularly engages with CEOs, I've observed a common fixation on end results. However, reflecting on my own career and those of successful leaders, it's clear that real value often emerges from the collective moments of triumph, failure, and growth along the way. This commentary explores the power of balancing destination-driven goals with an appreciation for the journey, offering a fresh perspective on leadership and organizational success that resonates in today's dynamic business landscape. About our guest: Robert A. Roda (Bob) joined HemoSonics in February 2020 as the company’s President and CEO, bringing more than 25 years of global experience developing and commercializing innovative diagnostic and medical device products and services. Most recently, Bob Roda served as President and CEO of Menarini Silicon Biosystems, Inc., a diagnostic and biotech company focused on the use of liquid biopsy and predictive diagnostic tests for the treatment of cancer patients. Prior to that position, he was Vice President and General Manager at Becton Dickinson, where he led the medical and procedural solutions business in the US. From 1998-2012, Bob held positions of increasing responsibility at Johnson & Johnson in both the medical device and diagnostic sectors, with his last role being worldwide VP Marketing in Immunohematology, Donor Screening, and Clinical Laboratories at Ortho Clinical Diagnostics, a J&J company. Bob earned a Bachelor of Arts in Economics from the University of Rhode Island and completed postgraduate coursework at Kellogg Graduate School of Management. Links from this episode: HemoSonics website HemoSonics YouTube channel: X @HemoSonics HemoSonics on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders

In this episode, Deborah welcomes Bob Roda, President and CEO of HemoSonics, about purpose-driven leadership in healthcare. Bob shares his journey from an economics major to a passionate advocate for improving patient care. He offers candid insights from his career at Johnson & Johnson to his current role in medical technology innovation. Bob's story emphasizes continuous learning and embracing both successes and failures. He provides a fresh take on leadership, stressing the importance of the journey as much as the destination. Bob's commitment to making a meaningful impact in healthcare is evident throughout the conversation. Join us for this engaging discussion on mentorship, the value of experience, and the challenges of driving change in clinical practice. Bob's insights offer valuable perspective for those at any stage of their career in, “Balancing the Blood Ledger: HemoSonics CEO on Innovation and Patient Care.” About our guest: Robert A. Roda (Bob) joined HemoSonics in February 2020 as the company’s President and CEO, bringing more than 25 years of global experience developing and commercializing innovative diagnostic and medical device products and services. Most recently, Bob Roda served as President and CEO of Menarini Silicon Biosystems, Inc., a diagnostic and biotech company focused on the use of liquid biopsy and predictive diagnostic tests for the treatment of cancer patients. Prior to that position, he was Vice President and General Manager at Becton Dickinson, where he led the medical and procedural solutions business in the US. From 1998-2012, Bob held positions of increasing responsibility at Johnson & Johnson in both the medical device and diagnostic sectors, with his last role being worldwide VP Marketing in Immunohematology, Donor Screening, and Clinical Laboratories at Ortho Clinical Diagnostics, a J&J company. Bob earned a Bachelor of Arts in Economics from the University of Rhode Island and completed postgraduate coursework at Kellogg Graduate School of Management. Links from this episode: HemoSonics website HemoSonics YouTube channel: X @HemoSonics HemoSonics on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders

Deborah Fell reflects on her recent conversation with James Hyman, a seasoned turnaround CEO and board member. Deborah discusses the key insights from their full episode, focusing on themes of leadership, accountability, and empowering teams. She shares her experience leading a diverse and accomplished team of sales and marketing executives from various industries, highlighting the challenges and rewards of being a "leader of leaders." Deborah emphasizes the importance of inspiring confidence, showing compassion, and knowing when to compromise. About James Hyman: James Hyman brings 25+ years of experience in international business leadership as CEO and Independent Director, driving demonstrated performance improvement. James has had responsibilities for operations, finance, M&A, and restructuring businesses across multiple US and European industries, as well as at leading companies such as GE Capital, McKinsey, JPMorgan & Starwood Hotels. He has delivered shareholder value as CEO of six companies, as a Board member of public & private companies, as an advisor to start-up/venture-backed companies, and as a Senior Advisor to Stifel’s Investment bank. He is a Partner with Marketing Strategies, LLC, which provides consulting and M&A advice to private equity firms and portfolio companies. As a Board member of 11 companies (currently Watterson Solutions), James works to focus the organization on business building and creating shareholder value within a structure of strong governance. As a Board member, he works with management on critical-path strategy issues, leadership development, and risk management. He has served on multiple committees: Audit (Chair), Compensation, Governance (Chair), and Transaction/Special Committees (Chair). As CEO, James is a leader who delivers shareholder value with large and sustained improvements in operating and financial performance - currently as CEO of PE-owned United Site Services, and previously of Corizon Health, Citizens Parking, CEC, and TestAmerica as well as Chairman & CEO of NYSE-traded Cornell Companies. For underperforming B2B services and industrial businesses, he brings strong process improvement and lean sigma skills to bear, emphasizing growth, top-grading, margin expansion, and return on capital.

In this episode of Success Beneath the Surface, James Hyman, a seasoned CEO and board member, shares his methodology for helping companies navigate complex restructuring processes. With a background spanning diverse industries and a track record of successful transformations, James offers invaluable insights for CEOs and business transformation leaders facing the daunting task of overhauling large to enterprise-sized organizations. James emphasizes the importance of broadening one's skill set, knowing what "good" looks like in various business functions, and leveraging the expertise of others to drive change. He also touches on the evolving role of AI in business and how leaders can prepare to harness its potential. Whether you're a CEO grappling with organizational challenges or a transformational leader seeking fresh perspectives, this episode provides a roadmap for those looking to steer their companies toward a more successful future. About James Hyman: James Hyman brings 25+ years of experience in international business leadership as CEO and Independent Director, driving demonstrated performance improvement. James has had responsibilities for operations, finance, M&A, and restructuring businesses across multiple US and European industries, as well as at leading companies such as GE Capital, McKinsey, JPMorgan & Starwood Hotels. He has delivered shareholder value as CEO of six companies, as a Board member of public & private companies, as an advisor to start-up/venture-backed companies, and as a Senior Advisor to Stifel’s Investment bank. He is a Partner with Marketing Strategies, LLC, which provides consulting and M&A advice to private equity firms and portfolio companies. As a Board member of 11 companies (currently Watterson Solutions), James works to focus the organization on business building and creating shareholder value within a structure of strong governance. As a Board member, he works with management on critical-path strategy issues, leadership development, and risk management. He has served on multiple committees: Audit (Chair), Compensation, Governance (Chair), and Transaction/Special Committees (Chair). As CEO, James is a leader who delivers shareholder value with large and sustained improvements in operating and financial performance - currently as CEO of PE-owned United Site Services, and previously of Corizon Health, Citizens Parking, CEC, and TestAmerica as well as Chairman & CEO of NYSE-traded Cornell Companies. For underperforming B2B services and industrial businesses, he brings strong process improvement and lean sigma skills to bear, emphasizing growth, top-grading, margin expansion, and return on capital.

In today's commentary, we revisit my conversation with Joe Leo, CEO and founder of Def Method, from episode 61. Joe's company focuses on breaking down data silos to help businesses connect the dots and gain valuable insights. When data is stuck in silos, it can lead to people and mindset silos as well, causing friction and draining energy. However, by bringing data together, a shared understanding emerges, allowing diversity of thought to invigorate the organization. Joe shares how his company evolved to focus on the high-risk data engineering projects many businesses need and how they've been able to templatize and orchestrate solutions. He also discusses the impact of AI on their work. To hear more, let's dive into the key parts of our discussion in this episode, “Marrying Data Silos for the Complete Picture.” Links from this episode: Joe Leo on LinkedIn Def Method's website Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Def Method: Def Method is a boutique consultancy with deep expertise in data science, data engineering, and custom software development. They are often brought in for executives' toughest data challenges. Their clients include giants like Citigroup, Dick's Sporting Goods, and the Museum of Modern Art down to smaller start-ups still getting their name on the map. They empower businesses of all sizes—from startups to major enterprises—to navigate the complexities of modern software development and achieve digital transformation. Their standout product, Def Method Powerhouse, helps companies harness their data with powerful tools and knowledgeable support. Powerhouse makes it easy for non-technical business users to glean insights from their data and communicate these insights to others.

Deborah Fell welcomes Joe Leo, the CEO and Founder of Def Method, a data science and custom software development consultancy. Joe's entrepreneurial journey started with a humorous misinterpretation of his father's advice, leading him to strike out on his own. As he navigated leadership challenges, Joe learned to focus on the right people and clients and deliver value. His detail-oriented approach and ability to learn from mistakes have been crucial in shaping Def Method's enduring company culture and success. From managing data silos to leveraging AI in revolutionary ways, Joe's experiences will resonate with seasoned SAAS entrepreneurs who have faced their own set of challenges. Key Points from this episode: Links from this episode: Joe Leo on LinkedIn Def Method's website Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Def Method: Def Method is a boutique consultancy with deep expertise in data science, data engineering, and custom software development. They are often brought in for executives' toughest data challenges. Their clients include giants like Citigroup, Dick's Sporting Goods, and the Museum of Modern Art down to smaller start-ups still getting their name on the map. They empower businesses of all sizes—from startups to major enterprises—to navigate the complexities of modern software development and achieve digital transformation. Their standout product, Def Method Powerhouse, helps companies harness their data with powerful tools and knowledgeable support. Powerhouse makes it easy for non-technical business users to glean insights from their data and communicate these insights to others.

In this episode of "Success Beneath the Surface," Deborah Fell shares a story sparked by her recent conversation with Susan Finch about understanding and nurturing individual team members. Deborah emphasizes the importance of recognizing each person's unique experiences and skills, and providing opportunities for growth and development. She highlights the value of creating a supportive environment where team members feel comfortable stepping out of their comfort zones, learning from their experiences, and receiving encouragement along the way. Deborah's insights offer valuable guidance for team leaders, including CSOs, HR professionals, and CEOs, who aim to unlock the full potential of their teams by embracing individuality and fostering a culture of trust, rather than micromanaging because you just want to be involved. Links from this episode: Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders Susan Finch on LinkedIn Funnel Media Group, LLC

Are you a business leader, HR professional, or entrepreneur looking to enhance your team's performance and harmony? In this special episode of "Success Beneath the Surface," host Susan Finch turns the tables on regular host Deborah Fell to uncover key insights on adaptive leadership. Drawing from her diverse experiences leading teams at Chief Outsiders, Marriott, and beyond, Deborah shares strategies for understanding individual team members, building trust quickly, and skillfully guiding conversations to defuse tensions and facilitate solutions. Whether you're taking over an existing team or working with a diverse, cross-functional group, you'll learn how to tailor your approach to different dynamics and generations. Tune in for valuable advice on effective communication, collaboration, and personal growth that extends beyond the business realm. Don't miss this unique opportunity to hear from Deborah and Susan as they explore the art of leadership in today's complex team environments. Who is this episode for:

In our last episode, Deborah interviewed Kyle Buckett, a retired member of the elite US Navy SEALs. Today, she focuses on one specific segment from that conversation where Kyle shares his insights on building high-performing teams and the parallels between military leadership and the business world. As a CEO, your role is to define a clear mission and assemble a team of leaders who can work together to achieve the impossible. Kyle's unique perspective, drawing from his experiences in both military and civilian settings, offers valuable lessons for anyone looking to create a culture of excellence in their organization. Listen to the full interview here: EP57: Lessons from a SEAL - Culture Improvement with Culture Fit to Build Your Elite Team Links from this episode: Kyle Buckett's book Culture Force Kyle Buckett on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Kyle Buckett: Kyle Buckett is an unshakable idealist who believes in a bright future and our ability to build it together through developing strong cultures. Kyle’s WHY is to refine and create positive cultures that attract great people. He believes great people working together make elite teams. Elite teams make organizations elite. And when you have elite organizations striving for excellence in their missions, the world is a much better place! With a vision to change the way businesses think, act, and operate, Kyle and his team work with leaders and organizations in nearly every industry to help transform company culture and create a better working world. As a retired Navy SEAL leader, board member, and former COO and CHRO of a publicly traded company, Kyle has discovered remarkable patterns in how some of the greatest movements in history were led by self-lead teams. He is fascinated by the people and organizations that make the greatest, lasting impact on the world. He has devoted his life to sharing his thinking, and leading movements to inspire people to do the things that inspire them.

Deborah Fell welcomes Kyle Buckett, a former Navy SEAL and author of "Leadership is Overrated." Buckett shares lessons from his military career and consulting work, emphasizing the importance of trust, delegating authority, and developing leaders at all levels. "Great people working together really makes elite teams. And when you have elite teams, you have organizations that become elite," Buckett notes. Listen to this episode, "Lessons from a SEAL: Culture Improvement with Culture Fit to Build Your Elite Team," to discover insights that can help transform your organization's culture and performance. Links from this episode: Kyle Buckett's book Culture Force Kyle Buckett on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Kyle Buckett: Kyle Buckett is an unshakable idealist who believes in a bright future and our ability to build it together through developing strong cultures. Kyle’s WHY is to refine and create positive cultures that attract great people. He believes great people working together make elite teams. Elite teams make organizations elite. And when you have elite organizations striving for excellence in their missions, the world is a much better place! With a vision to change the way businesses think, act, and operate, Kyle and his team work with leaders and organizations in nearly every industry to help transform company culture and create a better working world. As a retired Navy SEAL leader, board member, and former COO and CHRO of a publicly traded company, Kyle has discovered remarkable patterns about how some of the greatest movements in history were led by self lead teams. He is fascinated by the people and organizations that make the greatest, lasting impact on the world. He has devoted his life to sharing his thinking, and leading movements to inspire people to do the things that inspire them.

In this commentary, Deborah Fell reflects on her conversation with Joe Grace from the previous episode. She relates Joe's insights to her experience working with a trampoline park client in Canada whose business was threatened by new competitors. Deborah describes how she helped the client segment their customer database, tailor messaging and offers, and improve the customer experience, ultimately allowing them to recover lost revenue and grow the business. She emphasizes the importance of deeply understanding the customer and focusing on the details of the 360-degree experience. Deborah then highlights a clip from the Joe Grace interview where he discusses his success with direct-to-consumer marketing of the Thighmaster in the 80s and 90s, and how the insights he gained about marketing to women proved valuable in later turning around WebMD's struggling business. Links from this episode: JGrace@ChiefOutsiders.com Joe Grace on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders Profile page

In a world where brands struggle to connect with their audience, Joe Grace, Partner at Chief Outsiders and a seasoned marketer, shares his insights on the power of authentic storytelling and omnichannel marketing. From transforming WebMD into a household name to launching successful products like the Suzanne Somers Thighmaster, Joe's unique approach has consistently delivered results. He emphasizes the importance of understanding your target audience, crafting a genuine brand positioning, and adapting your story as competition emerges. Drawing from his diverse background in business and the film industry, Joe reveals how weaving together compelling narratives and leveraging the right mix of media channels can accelerate your company's growth. Join Deborah as she delves into Joe's wealth of experience and uncovers the secrets to captivating your customers through authenticity. About Deborah's Guest, Joe Grace: For over 25 years, Joe has disrupted industries, introduced new products, grown market share, accelerated growth, and built brands with the power and efficiency of direct-to-consumer marketing strategies. As the Head of Marketing at WebMD, Joe developed and executed the marketing strategy that grew WebMD into the most trusted source for online health information with over 40 million registered members. As a Partner with Chief Outsiders since 2011, Joe has created growth strategies for a broad range of healthcare companies, including Pharma, medical devices, providers, payors, and more. Links from this episode: JGrace@ChiefOutsiders.com Joe Grace on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders Profile page

In episode 49 of Success Beneath the Surface, host Deborah Fell spoke with Torey Carter Conneen, CEO of the American Society of Landscape Architects. One key theme was simplifying complexity. As the leader of a trade association with diverse constituents, Torey sees his role as uniting everyone around a shared mission. Deborah reflects that whether in complex organizations like Torey's or simpler ones, complexity can quickly arise from a lack of listening and leadership. Without the air of inspiration, problem-solving focus, and commitment to achieving better outcomes together, complexity takes over. Torey shares how his roles have been driven by a deep connection to organizational missions and purposes that align with his own values. About Torey Carter-Conneen An accomplished executive leader with over 20 years of experience, Torey Carter Conneen formulates strategies and plans to drive organizational success. As COO of AILA, he oversees operations, education, conferences, publications, finance, and more to support the 15,000+ immigration attorney members. He led the development of strategic and operating plans and ensured accountability against goals. As SVP, Finance, and CFO at the Center for American Progress, he oversaw accounting, administration, and IT for the $50M organization and advised the President & CEO as part of the executive team. As Acting President & CEO of the Victory Fund and Institute, he partnered with leaders and the Board on strategic, operating, and financial plans during the CEO’s sabbatical. He excels at managing deadlines and challenges while delivering immediate results. Skilled at cultivating engaging work environments to promote performance excellence. Torey Carter-Conneen on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders

In this insightful commentary episode of Success Beneath the Surface, host Deborah Fell shares her key takeaways from her conversation with Alexei Miller, Managing Director of DataArt. Discover the secrets behind DataArt's impressive employee referral and loyalty metrics, which have remained strong over decades of growth. Alexei emphasizes the importance of a culture-based organization, where informal ties, trust, and freedom fuel employee longevity and willingness to refer others. However, as the company scales, maintaining this culture becomes increasingly challenging. Alexei candidly discusses the difficulties of passing on the company's culture to new hires as DataArt expands rapidly. Despite these challenges, DataArt's employee loyalty metrics remain high compared to industry standards. To dive deeper into Alexei's masterclass on building culture and retaining people, be sure to listen to the full episode: EP52: Humble Beginnings to Global Success - The DataArt Story Links from this episode: Alexei Miller on LinkedIn DataArt Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Alexei Miller: Alexei Miller is a Managing Director at DataArt. He leads strategic sales and client engagement efforts for global technology consultancy, focusing on IT strategy, new system development, and technology innovation. Alexei joined DataArt when the company was founded, in 1997, and was elected to the Board of Directors in 2002. Over the past two decades, he has been overseeing product and service development, delivery, sales and management of key accounts and has built DataArt’s Finance practice. Alexei has been instrumental in establishing DataArt’s position as a global technology leader dedicated to service excellence and helping to significantly grow the company's operations on a global scale.

Step into the world of Alexei Miller, managing director at DataArt, as he engages in a captivating discussion with host, Deborah Fell on Success Beneath the Surface. Alexei's story is one of curiosity, adaptability, and the power of a strong company culture, from his humble beginnings in a little town in the north of Russia, beyond the polar circle, to his 27-year journey to being part of a team leading DataArt, a global software engineering firm. He shares his insights on fostering employee loyalty, navigating the ever-changing landscape of AI, and creating an environment where people can thrive. Alexei's passion for his work and people shines through in this thought-provoking conversation, leaving listeners with valuable lessons on leadership and success in the tech industry. Tune in for an engaging exploration of what it takes to build a company that stands the test of time. Links from this episode: Alexei Miller on LinkedIn DataArt Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders About Alexei Miller: Alexei Miller is a Managing Director at DataArt. He leads strategic sales and client engagement efforts for global technology consultancy, focusing on IT strategy, new system development, and technology innovation. Alexei joined DataArt when the company was founded, in 1997, and was elected to the Board of Directors in 2002. Over the past two decades, he has been overseeing product and service development, delivery, sales and management of key accounts and has built DataArt’s Finance practice. Alexei has been instrumental in establishing DataArt’s position as a global technology leader dedicated to service excellence and helping to significantly grow the company's operations on a global scale.

In this episode, Deborah shares her anticipation for the upcoming Chief Outsiders National Conference, where she will be recapping the event and conducting insightful interviews. Reflecting on the growth and success of Chief Outsiders over the years, Deborah emphasizes the importance of vision casting and fostering a culture of collaboration. As we look forward to the conference highlights, Deborah encourages listeners to revisit Art Saxby's full episode for valuable insights on strategic growth. Stay tuned for exciting recaps and interviews from the conference on "Success Beneath the Surface"! EP25: Scaling Your Business - Curiosity and Leadership

Deborah Fell unpacks key insights on gaining alignment from her conversation with Torey Carter-Conneen, CEO of the American Society of Landscape Architects. With multiple stakeholders to consider, Torey shares how he approaches creating change and uniting his team behind a common vision. Deborah reflects on how a lack of alignment in an organization, though often invisible, manifests in lower scores and sales momentum. Torey stresses the "trust equation" - communicating the why behind decisions while listening carefully to staff and members. For CEOs leading their teams through change, this commentary offers takeaways on fostering trust and strategic alignment. Tune in to hear Torey's advice on maintaining focus amidst competing priorities. About Torey Carter-Conneen An accomplished executive leader with over 20 years of experience, Torey Carter Conneen formulates strategies and plans to drive organizational success. As COO of AILA, he oversees operations, education, conferences, publications, finance, and more to support the 15,000+ immigration attorney members. He led the development of strategic and operating plans and ensured accountability against goals. As SVP, Finance, and CFO at the Center for American Progress, he oversaw accounting, administration, and IT for the $50M organization and advised the President & CEO as part of the executive team. As Acting President & CEO of the Victory Fund and Institute, he partnered with leaders and the Board on strategic, operating, and financial plans during the CEO’s sabbatical. He excels at managing deadlines and challenges while delivering immediate results. Skilled at cultivating engaging work environments to promote performance excellence. Listen to his full episode here. Links from this episode: Torey Carter-Conneen on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders

Do you aspire to lead with purpose and service? This week’s Success Beneath the Surface podcast features a remarkable discussion with Torey Carter Conneen, CEO of the American Society of Landscape Architects. Host Deborah Fell artfully draws out Conneen's inspiring path to nonprofit leadership guided by his family’s ethos of community service. From his first nonprofit role out of college to helming major associations today, Conneen walks the talk of mission-driven business. He shares the CEO mindset needed to align strategy with core values during difficult decisions, constantly engaging stakeholders while moving change forward. For growth leaders who want their organizations to balance purpose, service and sustainability while thriving financially, this is an episode you can’t miss. Tune in for an uplifting dose of wisdom. About Torey Carter-Conneen An accomplished executive leader with over 20 years of experience, Torey Carter Conneen formulates strategies and plans to drive organizational success. As COO of AILA, he oversees operations, education, conferences, publications, finance, and more to support the 15,000+ immigration attorney members. He led the development of strategic and operating plans and ensured accountability against goals. As SVP, Finance, and CFO at the Center for American Progress, he oversaw accounting, administration, and IT for the $50M organization and advised the President & CEO as part of the executive team. As Acting President & CEO of the Victory Fund and Institute, he partnered with leaders and the Board on strategic, operating, and financial plans during the CEO’s sabbatical. He excels at managing deadlines and challenges while delivering immediate results. Skilled at cultivating engaging work environments to promote performance excellence. Torey Carter-Conneen on LinkedIn Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders

When established "truths" in business become outdated, companies that fail to adapt often struggle. In this episode commentary, host Deborah Fell explores a Mark Twain quote on questioning assumptions with guest Barry Traylor, co-founder of Sales Mastery. Barry explains why the "perfect prospect profile" can limit a company's vision and relationships. He advocates customizing outreach to understand individual customers’ needs better rather than treating everyone equally. He also discusses how adding value and sharing insights, not just selling, builds meaningful business connections over time. For growth-focused executives, re-evaluating internal "certainties" periodically and implementing more nuanced, customer-centric strategies can yield better long-term results. Link to Barry's full episode here. About Barry Trailer Barry is Co-Founder of Sales Mastery Advisors, a sales research and advisory services firm started in 2018. Earlier, he was the founder and CEO of a successful SMB CRM company (acquired in 2000) before co-founding and helping lead CSO Insights, which he and his partner sold to Miller Heiman (2015-2017). Barry has been published three times in Harvard Business Review, most recently in Nov-Dec 2022, and has twice been the keynote at their Sales Summit in Poland. He is an Accenture Luminary and has been involved in complex B2B sales for over 35 years. He’s intrigued with how it’s changed/changing and what this means to Sales as a Profession (SaaP). Links from this episode: Barry Trailer on LinkedIn Sales Mastery website Sales Master on YouTube Deborah Fell on LinkedIn Chief Outsiders