Climbing Business Journal Podcasts

As the routesetting field continues to become more professionalized, so do our standards and expectations. On this episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen talks with Colorado-based routesetter Daniel Cornella about the state of routesetting education and the elements of good competition sport routes. Dan first discovered climbing thanks to his high school biology teacher, took a detour to serve in the Marines in California, and eventually found his way back to the Colorado climbing scene. In 2013, he was introduced to routesetting at Life Time Fitness by Matt Lloyd. If you’ve climbed in a Colorado gym in the last decade—from the iconic 90s-era gym Rock’n & Jam’n (now The Spot Thornton) to various Movement locations—chances are you’ve pulled on something set by Dan, who is now the Assistant Director of Routesetting at Movement’s Centennial facility. Dan is also a USAC Level 4 Setter and has set for Youth Nationals, National Cups and Vail Citizens competitions. He has also chiefed half a dozen youth championship events. Outside of climbing, Dan works in high rigging for concerts at major Colorado venues, such as Ball Arena. Above all else, he is a proud husband and father. General Topics Covered Show Notes Dan CornellaMovement x B-Pump Collaboration Brings Japanese Routesetting and Training to ColoradoRumble in the Rockies Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver Podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Essential Climbing and Strati. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

This episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast is a little historical. There is so much that is often recounted and celebrated related to the heritage and lineage of outdoor climbing, and there is an equally fascinating counterpart to that history with the history of indoor climbing. The wonderful industry that we have now with climbing gyms includes components that are largely unique to the indoor scene. Things like routesetting and artificial holds, coaches, comps…These elements didn't just appear suddenly in gyms; they had to germinate and develop over a long period of time. And that's not news to anyone who is listening to this podcast. It is worth pointing out that, more often than not, there was a person or a small group of people who were at the vanguard of those ideas and various developments. That background leads to today's guest, Mike Pont. Mike was one of the people leading the charge in the earliest days of indoor climbing, and particularly the earliest days of routesetting. He was among the first group of people in the United States who actually thought of themselves as routesetters in the late 1980s and early 1990s, when climbing gyms were few and far between. And Mike Pont, along with a few other people, helped make routesetting a concept and helped put it into practice. Mike was also involved in organizing some of the earliest large-scale climbing competitions in the U.S. and was involved in the climbing portion of the ESPN X Games. He basically had a front row seat for the generational turnover in sport climbing and in the climbing industry that occurred in the 90s. Mike and host John Burgman get into all those instrumental beginnings for our industry on today’s show. General Topics Covered Show Notes @mikepont1 Thank you EP Climbing and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen sits down with Nickolas Gagliardi to get us thinking about USAC events as routesetters gear up for the upcoming youth competition season. Nick started setting in 2015 in St. Paul, Minnesota. While that beginning was only ten years ago, Nick experienced the industry when many setters were still getting paid by the route and boulder, specifically: $7 a boulder, $11 a top-rope route, $15 a lead route and $26 for setting the roof. From there, Nick moved to Colorado where he set at the Earth Treks gyms—now Movement—before he finally landed in Portland, Oregon. Now, Nick is a USAC Level 3 routesetter and the Director of Setting at Portland Rock Gym. When he’s not setting, Nick is often climbing outdoors, playing video games, and trying to get better at Go. General Topics Covered Show Notes Nick GagliardiPortland Rock Gym2025 Youth National ChampionshipsUSA Climbing RoutesettersBoulder QE Setting GuidelinesTop Rope/Lead GuidelinesUSAC RulebookYou’re Stronger if You’re Honest: Behind the Wrench With Abby WilsonSetting the Tone: What Makes a Space Feel Good? – CBJ Podcast with Jesse SaffordNo One Sets Alone: Collective Authorship – CBJ Podcast with Ruth Jang“You Can Strip My Boulder.” – CBJ Podcast with Blake Green Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Kilter and Bold Climbing. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today's podcast episode features an interview with gym founder Eric Hires. Eric is the co-owner of Stone Climbing, the first location of which opened in St. Augustine, Florida, several years ago. Now, there's a second Stone Climbing gym that is quickly approaching its grand opening in Jacksonville, Florida. Eric talks with host John Burgman about the development and the construction of both those gyms. The new Stone Climbing gym that's about to open in Jacksonville is a 16,000-square-foot ground-up build, with boulders and roped climbs. The focus of this conversation with Eric is on the challenges (and opportunities) inherent in opening a gym in a place like Florida, which certainly has some gym climbing history but doesn't have an outdoor climbing heritage per se. John was also curious to get Eric's insights on the lessons he learned from opening that first gym…and how Eric is applying those lessons to the opening of a second gym. So, keep listening to hear how jotting something down on a barroom napkin was crucial in the creation of Eric's gyms in Florida. General Topics Covered Show Notes @stoneclimbingco Thank you Approach and Strati for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this expansive episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen brings on two setters—Nat Vorel and Mia DePaolis—to talk about paraclimbing and parasetting, diving into fundamentals and tips that any setter can put into practice. Nat Vorel is based in Oklahoma City and has been climbing for ten years, paraclimbing for around five of them. They are a four-time National Champion and have five World Cup podiums. Nat started setting five years ago and turned freelance recently. Nat has set for a variety of competitions, from local qualifiers and citizens comps to paraclimbing comps. They have a USAC L1 setting certification and an AMGA Single Pitch Instructor certification for guiding. Climbing and setting aside, Nat is a costume designer and would like to shout out their three tabby cats, whom they love dearly. Mia DePaolis is the Head Routesetter at Central Rock Gym in Randolph, Massachusetts. She has been climbing for over twenty years and setting for ten of those years. After hearing from some local paraclimbers, Mia began to run an annual paraclimbing comp, the Randolph Rumble, at CRG. She is a USAC Level 3 routesetter with only one more national event to go before obtaining the next level. She is also a certified sports nutrition coach. Outside of climbing and setting, Mia worked as a beekeeper for many years and continues to love bees. General Topics Covered Show Notes Nat Vorel on InstagramMia DePaolis on InstagramCentral Rock GymUSAC ParaclimbingUSAC Parasetting ClinicsIFSC ParaclimbingEhlers-Danlos SyndromesRandolph RumblePara Climbing Set to Make Paralympics Debut Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by EP Climbing and Trango. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host John Burgman checks out a new gym, ROQ, that is currently expected to open this fall in Seattle. The gym is quite unique in concept within the climbing gym industry, although somewhat par for the course in the fitness gym industry. Guest Michael Hauss is the founder and CEO of ROQ. The boutique climbing gym will feature high-intensity, hour-long workouts in a class setting, led by an instructor or trainer. In their conversation, Hauss and Burgman talk all about how the concept for the unique climbing gym came about, and how Hauss plans to run it in the vein of boutique fitness gyms with classes, instructors, and very high-intensity group training. General Topics Covered Show Notes ROQ@ROQClimbing Thank you Approach and Essential Climbing for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Jesse Safford (they/them) started climbing during college in Montana, but it wasn’t until they moved to Grand Rapids, Michigan, that they stumbled upon setting. Now Jesse is the Head Setter at Terra Firma. Jesse is also an avid comp setter, chiefing and setting their annual in-house Rabble Rouser competition at Terra Firma, and has set for Death Moth, Siege the Southeast and Flight of the Phoenix, among many others. Most recently, they’re extremely excited about the upcoming Midwest Mayhem series. Outside of climbing, Jesse is a birdwatcher, Dungeons and Dragons player, and cat parent. What does D&D have to do with working on a routesetting team? How can we all play a role in improving our team dynamics? Jesse and Holly dive into those topics and much more on today’s episode. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramTerra FirmaDeath MothSiege the SoutheastMidwest MayhemFlight of the PhoenixDungeons and Dragonsbattle strategy Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Approach and Trango. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today on the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host John Burgman meets with Jonathan Brandt. Jonathan is one of the co-founders of a new climbing gym in Holland, Michigan, called Shift. It's a 12,000-square-foot, bouldering-focused facility, and by Jonathan's own admission, there aren't a lot of bells and whistles in the gym, meaning there aren't a ton of fancy accouterments or amenities that are too far afield from climbing. Inside the space is primarily a bunch of really cool boulders and the community of staff and stoke that has developed around those blocks. Jonathan has been in or around the climbing industry for about 20 years. So, Shift’s founding comes with a lot of expertise and experience. You'll hear Jonathan explain how and why he felt the timing was right now, after all these years, to finally open his own gym. And he acknowledges there are a ton of other bouldering gyms out there right now. So, the question becomes: How do you stand out in this day and age? How do you set your new gym apart from the pack? There are several ways to answer that question, but Jonathan's contention is that, in the case of Shift, it has a lot to do with the staff you hire and the culture that staff helps to build. General Topics Covered Show Notes Shift@shiftclimbing Thank you Approach and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast, host Holly Chen sits down with Carly Snidow. Carly is a routesetter at Vital’s Lower East Side location in Manhattan, New York. She has been climbing for almost a decade, and her setting career started like many others—setting college climbing walls and bugging local routesetters. Now, Carly is a USAC Level 1 routesetter with a dozen competitions under her belt up to the divisionals level. She has set for several citizens' comps as well, including Siege the Southeast. Carly is also a coach and personal trainer. Prior to setting, Carly studied philosophy, neuroscience and psychology. She has extensive lab experience spanning multiple disciplines, from microbiology to behavioral neuroscience and developmental psychology. Carly brings that scientific lens to the show today, challenging how we think about goal setting and success in the routesetting field. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramVital, Lower East SideInductive LogicHippocampal and amygdala volumes vary with residential proximity to toxicants at Birmingham, Alabama's 35th Avenue Superfund site Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle, or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Butora and Essential Climbing. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host Scott Rennak meets with Mark Grossman and Will Jorgensen of the Monument Sports Group. They manage the US Group Insurance Plan for our industry in partnership with the CWA, and they cover hundreds of climbing walls. Mark and Will have deep experience in facility operations. You'll hear on today’s show about their backgrounds, how they approach their insurance work, and the headwinds the indoor climbing industry is facing. General Topics Covered Show Notes CWA Insurance ProgramMonument Sports GroupDOXA Thank you OnSite and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Obe Carrion is the guest of this episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast, hosted by John Burgman. Obe has long been one of the biggest names in the game as a pro climber. Over the years, he has worked with multiple brands, and he's been in multiple climbing films, including the 1998’s Free Hueco! and 1999’s Rampage. He has been a coach, a mentor, and through all of the evolutions he has remained a force of nature in the climbing industry. John and Obe talk about Obe’s career and psych in climbing: how psych is never a constant, but how there can be value in it as an unknown, and in the way that motivation comes and goes and then comes back again eventually. Obe also reflects on climbing in the 1990s, the filming of that famous Rampage documentary—in which Chris Sharma stole the show at an X Games in San Francisco on this day, 26 years ago—hanging with Sharma, coaching the next generation, and evolving with the times. General Topics Covered Show Notes @obe_carrionRampage on YouTube Thank you Approach and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Joey is the co-founder and owner of his own hold company, called Ocelot Grips, out of Oregon. But Ocelot Grips is the end product, or at least the current end, of many, many years of Joey working in the industry as a hold shaper. He has designed and shaped holds for a lot of different brands over the years. He gets into his story in more detail in this episode, but he also offers some fascinating insights on his artistic philosophy for shapes and how that works in conjunction with his philosophy for functionality in shapes. Because hold shaping is like routesetting in that sense; it’s partially an artistic craft as well as a utilitarian or commercial craft. Art, commerce, functionality—it's all wrapped up in the life of a hold shaper. And, as a longtime shaper and setter, Joey is a great guest for riffing on all of those finer points of the craft. General Topics Covered Show Notes Ocelot Grips@ocelotgrips Thank you EP Climbing and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s episode brings Ruth Jang to the show. Ruth is a routesetter at Central Rock Gym in Atlanta, Georgia. She first picked up setting as a bucket list challenge and because she saw a gap in the gym: not enough entry-level, competition-style boulders for people to learn from. Her thought? “Why not infiltrate from the inside and learn from the best?” Before she knew it, she was pulled into the gravity of the setting world. Today, Ruth is a USAC Level 3 routesetter with her first national event on the horizon this June. She’s also set for citizen comps like Method Underground. Before setting, Ruth came from a background in academia and biomedical research, where she studied stem cells and the opioid epidemic. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramLogic of the WoodsCentral Rock GymFutsalHow East and West think in profoundly different waysCultural differences are far more nuanced than East vs West“I think, therefore I am.”National Eating Disorder AssociationNational Institute of Mental Health - Eating Disorders Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle, or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Essential Climbing and Trango. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Brian is the General Manager and Co-Owner of Bluestem Boulders in Ames, Iowa. It's a fairly new gym, having opened last November. The climbing walls and flooring at the gym are by Onsite, and the CRM software is by GymDesk. But what's noteworthy for today's conversation is that Bluestem is only two miles from the campus of Iowa State University, so students from the university form a large customer base for the gym. There are many other climbing gyms around the country near colleges, where students already frequent the gym. And there are also gyms near a college that are trying to figure out how to break into the university market, asking: “How do we get more of those college students to come into our gym? How do you draw the college demographic into a gym? How can a gym work with a nearby college? What kind of programs seem to resonate most with college students?” There are no magic answers to these questions, but there is plenty to talk about when it comes to better serving a college population, and that’s the subject John gets into today with Brian. General Topics Covered Show Notes Bluestem Boulders@bluestembouldersBouldering Gym Opens Two Miles From Iowa State University Thank you Butora and RGP for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s episode brings routesetter Iza Nowak to the podcast. Nowak is a team climber turned routesetting powerhouse. She started climbing as a kid and has almost two decades of time on rocks and plastic. Her setting career has spanned multiple states. Now, Nowak is a lead setter at Sport Rock in Washington, D.C. She is a USAC Level 3 routesetter with competition experience at all levels, from climbing leagues to Qualifying Events to high-level citizens’ comps, like Method Underground and national-level bouldering and sport competitions. Nowak has also traveled internationally to set, having recently returned from the Norwegian Youth Championships. Nowak brings all that knowledge to the show, diving into fundamentals for both competition and commercial routesetting, skills for leading a setting crew, and much more. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramSportrock Climbing CentersRoutesetter PathwayLean In: Women, Work, and the Will to Leadone Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle, or have questions–we’d love for you to reach out here. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Rock Gym Pro and Bold Climbing. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the CBJ podcast, host John Burgman and Jonathan Landis, the CEO of Greater Heights, talk about the winding path from an idea to the construction and, finally, the grand opening of a new climbing gym. Greater Heights opened in early December 2024 in Fitchburg, Wisconsin—which is right around Madison—and has ropes, boulders and auto belays. The climbing walls at the gym are from Rockwerx, the flooring is from Asana, and Rock Gym Pro is the management software. John and Jonathan chat all about the origin of Greater Heights and the origin of Jonathan's involvement with the gym. They discuss Jonathan's outlook on how climbing gyms are like a subscription service, in a way. They also focus on the Midwest as a good region for a climbing gym, and Jonathan, as a lifelong Midwesterner, offers some keen insights on getting one started. General Topics Covered Show Notes Greater Heights@gh.climbingNew Full-Service Gym Is Coming to Wisconsin’s Capital This Winter Thank you Approach and EP Climbing for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s episode brings routesetter Ethan Paris to the recording studio. Paris comes from a film and creative background, giving him a unique perspective on how routesetters operate in a space that can be defined half by art and half by design. Hailing from the Northeast, he moved to Colorado in 2024 to set at the Climbing Collective gyms in Longmont, Loveland and Greeley. Paris is a USAC Level 2 routesetter and has set for over 20 local and USAC competitions nationwide. He’s also participated in the Setter Showdown in Hawaii, taken setting clinics in London, and hopes to one day set for national-level events. Host Holly Chen talks to Paris about the prevalence of imposter syndrome in the routesetting industry. They explore the origins and characteristics of the phenomenon, from the term’s conception in 1978 to how imposter syndrome impacts today’s modern routesetting community. They talk about how it manifests across the gender spectrum, and how difficult it can be to overcome. Finally, they discuss how community is often the ticket out. General Topics Covered [the_ad_group id="625"] Show Notes InstagramClimbing CollectiveThe Imposter Phenomenon in High Achieving Women: Dynamics and Therapeutic InterventionWhy Everyone Feels Like They’re Faking ItKaizen (Ky'zen), The Key to Japan's Competitive SuccessInclusion Takes Intention: Behind the Desk With Gabby Zonneveld at MetroRockVans on the Wall – CBJ Podcast with Ally CruzKeep Them Sketched Out – CBJ Podcast with Claire Kawainui MillerThe Top CBJ Podcast Episode of 2024 for Routesetters Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle, or have questions–we’d love for you to reach out here. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Bold Climbing and Rock Gym Pro sponsor today's episode. It was edited and produced by Holly Chen, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast, host John Burgman is joined by Megan Cheek. Megan is the Digital Marketing Manager and Content Strategist for Climbing Collective, which includes the Inner Peaks gyms in North Carolina, Philadelphia Rock Gyms in Pennsylvania, and Hudson Boulders in New York. They talk about what the Climbing Collective is and how several different gyms and gym brands operate within it. From there, they chat about Megan's role as a content strategist and what it means to create content for gyms these days. John and Megan pinpoint the new Inner Peaks location, which is in the NoDa neighborhood of Charlotte. They discuss the NoDa gym's layout and the focus at the gym on the first-time climber’s journey. To that point, Megan provides some insights on how a gym's layout can help foster the development of a climber, from beginners to longtime members. General Topics Covered Show Notes @InnerPeaksClimbing@PhilaRockGym@HudsonBoulders Thank you Butora and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

In this episode, Impact Driver host Holly Chen speaks with Taylor Fragomeni. Like many other professional routesetters, Taylor's career started at her university's climbing wall, which for her was in in Bozeman, Montana, in 2012. Taylor then moved into working in the climbing space full-time. She's worn various hats over the years, the most significant being Head Routesetter and Head Coach at Spire Climbing and Fitness. She has set for dozens of local comps—many of which she chiefed—as well as several USAC youth comps up to the divisional level for both sport and bouldering. Now Taylor has stepped back from full-time routesetting to work with the Bozeman Climbing team again. She's also focusing on her own business, Tangent Climbing, where she coaches youth athletes, league climbers and other routesetters with the mission of helping folks develop a lifelong, sustainable relationship with the sport we love. When she's not on the wall or mentoring the next generation, Taylor enjoys writing and listening to music, indulging in thrillers, and connecting with her community. On the podcast, Taylor and Holly talk about routesetting occupational hazards, both physical and mental burnout, and how to tackle these challenges. They dissect differences between common injuries in competition setting and commercial setting, how those injuries can lead to physical burnout in routesetting, and how you can form budget-conscious partnerships with local businesses that benefit routesetters. Taylor also speaks on private coaching and the inspiration behind her business. Finally, they break down some routesetting efficiencies and injury prevention tips for various levels of routesetting, workloads, and ability levels. Thank you Butora and Essential Climbing for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today host Scott Rennak sits down with Garnet Moore, Executive Director of the Climbing Wall Association. Garnet is one of the most connected and central figures in the North American climbing industry, overseeing both the CWA and their annual trade show, the CWA Summit. His origins in the manufacturing side have equipped him with a wide perspective on the climbing industry and climbing culture. During his tenure at CWA, he has steered the organization through the COVID pandemic, helping industry businesses regain their footing and go from surviving to thriving. Today, he’s leading the charge to preserve the culture of personal responsibility in our climbing facilities. Scott and Garnet talk about all these topics and much more. Thank you OnSite for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!