Positioning with April Dunford

In today’s episode, I explore why market category is a good starting point for developing great positioning. You will learn: * Viewing your market category is context-setting for your products/company. * Thinking of your market category as being similar to the opening scene of a movie. (See link below for my article about this idea, which includes the opening scene of the movie Baby Driver.) * Understanding your product/company's unique value proposition before determining market category. * Why positioning involves identifying what sets your product apart from competitors and the status quo. * Why positioning in an underserved segment of an existing market category is easier than creating a new category. * Communicating the differentiated value of your product or service. * Why companies need to go deeping into their value props to help customers understand how they can deliver unique value for their business. — If you want to skip ahead: (3:50) Market categories and their role in positioning products/companies, with a focus on differentiated value. (7:46) Positioning and messaging for startups, focusing on understanding customer needs and differentiated value. (11:26) Positioning and market categories in business. — Connect with April Dunford and learn about practical positioning that accelerates marketing and sales: Work with April: https://www.aprildunford.com/consultant April’s newsletter: https://aprildunford.substack.com/ April’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ April’s Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Mentioned in this episode: * My article about market category in which I discuss the opening scene of the movie Baby Driver: https://aprildunford.substack.com/p/understanding-the-job-of-a-market * Positioning: The Battle for Your Mind, a book by Al Ries and Jack Trout: https://amzn.to/3JrR4zJ — Get April Dunford’s books and audiobooks: “Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning so Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It.” “Sales Pitch: How to Craft a Story to Stand Out and Win.” Amazon US: https://amzn.to/49l0ZRY Amazon Canada: https://amzn.to/4ac9hgt Amazon UK: https://amzn.to/3vosDzQ — The Positioning with April Dunford podcast: Want to make your product stand out in a crowded market? It all starts with great positioning. Using April’s battle-tested methodology, she'll teach you the nitty-gritty of positioning so that you can unlock better marketing and sales performance. Podcast website: https://www.positioning.show/ Subscribe on Apple Podcasts:

In today’s episode, I talk with a technology entrepreneur about lessons related to his product initially being mispositioned in the market and also the challenges of positioning both free and paid versions of software solutions. Joining me is Abhinav Asthana, founder and CEO of Postman, an API platform for software developers to build and use APIs. In today’s episode: * How Postman's positioning evolved from a product-focused approach to a platform-focused approach, with different positioning for end-users and executives. * Building Postman with the conviction that modern software is built on APIs, and evangelizing (positioning) this idea to investors. * Why top-down positioning needs to align with company strategy. * The value of working with analysts to understand customer needs and improve products. * Positioning software in terms of satisfying customer needs. * The importance of staying ahead of competitors in the enterprise software market. * The challenges of competing with free products and prioritizing user experience. * Abhinav advises talking to 50-100 customers per year to gain insights and build conviction in product decisions. — If you want to skip ahead: (2:24) Origin story of Postman. (7:19) Postman's growth, fundraising, and positioning challenges. (12:57) API platform growth and top-down sales strategies. (18:03) Taking an API-first approach in software development and marketing strategies. (28:19) Scaling velocity, competitors, and customer engagement in the enterprise software space. — Connect with Abhinav Asthana on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/abhinavasthana/ Learn about Postman’s API platform: https://www.postman.com/ — Connect with April Dunford and learn about practical positioning that accelerates marketing and sales: Work with April: https://www.aprildunford.com/contact April’s newsletter: https://aprildunford.substack.com/ April’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ April’s Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Mentioned in this episode: “Breaking Changes,” a podcast where Postman Chief Evangelist Kin Lane and guests talk about the API universe: https://www.postman.com/events/breaking-changes/ “The API-First Transformation,” a book by Kin Lane with a foreword by Abhinav Asthana: https://amzn.to/3PZzEOy — Get April Dunford’s books and audiobooks: “Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning so Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It.” “Sales Pitch: How to Craft a Story to Stand Out and Win.” Amazon US: https://amzn.to/49l0ZRY Amazon Canada: https://amzn.to/4ac9hgt Amazon UK:

Welcome to Season 2! In today’s episode, I explore why positioning fails to make the jump from marketing to sales in many companies, and what common misconceptions and mistakes in positioning work should be avoided. You will learn: * Why sales teams often lack a deep understanding of positioning and its importance in the sales process. * Communicating value and positioning product consistently across all sales calls, even for new sales reps. * What happens when marketing creates positioning without consulting sales, leading to disconnect between the two teams. * The disconnect between sales teams and marketing teams, as marketing decks often don't account for the need for discovery and objection handling during sales calls. * Two common unspoken objections in sales pitches: pricing and change management. * Common challenges in transitioning positioning from marketing to sales, including inadequate decks. * In enterprise and B2B deals, multiple stakeholders involved in a deal can lead to multiple pitch decks, making the process more complicated. * Customizing pitch decks for the champion, with a focus on resonating with their needs and concerns, rather than trying to address the objections of other stakeholders in the deal. — If you want to skip ahead: (0:01) Positioning in B2B marketing and sales. (4:25) Sales strategy and customer understanding. (8:55) Why marketing and sales positioning often doesn't align. (13:18) Sales pitches and unspoken objections. (18:00) B2B purchase process and positioning for sales. (23:24) Customizing sales pitch decks for different personas. — Connect with April Dunford and learn about practical positioning that accelerates marketing and sales: Work with April: https://www.aprildunford.com/contact April’s newsletter: https://aprildunford.substack.com/ April’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ April’s Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Get April Dunford’s books and audiobooks: “Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning so Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It” “Sales Pitch: How to Craft a Story to Stand Out and Win” Amazon US: https://amzn.to/49l0ZRY Amazon Canada: https://amzn.to/4ac9hgt Amazon UK: https://amzn.to/3vosDzQ — The Positioning with April Dunford podcast: Want to make your product stand out in a crowded market? It all starts with great positioning. Using April’s battle-tested methodology, she'll teach you the nitty-gritty of positioning so that you can unlock better marketing and sales performance. Podcast website: https://www.positioning.show/ Subscribe on Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/3PFHcWx Subscribe on Spotify: https://spoti.fi/4aqyDqI Subscribe on YouTube:

Today, I’m going to discuss how to have consistent positioning and messaging across sales and marketing using tactics from my book Sales Pitch. You will learn: You'll also hear that this is the final episode of Season 1, as I'm excited to take a break from podcasting for the rest of the year. Thanks for listening and supporting the podcast, and I look forward to recording more content next year! — If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:21) An overview of my consulting work and season 1 finale (01:11) Why marketing should center their storytelling on what works for sales (05:30) How and why to use a buyer’s guide with customers (09:13) How to incorporate the Sales Pitch structure into explainer videos (10:20) Other places pieces of the sales narrative may work well (11:07) The significance of different personas (12:10) Leveraging the sales narrative set up phase for conference talks (13:30) How graphics can enhance understanding of differentiated value (14:09) The graphics Postman created to illustrate its features and capabilities (16:20) Gitlab’s infinity graphic (17:16) Salesforce’s confusing infographic (19:30) Other ways to use my Sales Pitch structure (21:13) Closing thoughts — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: ⁠https://www.positioning.show/⁠ Personal Website: ⁠https://www.aprildunford.com/⁠ LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/⁠ Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/⁠ Twitter: ⁠https://twitter.com/aprildunford⁠ — Referenced: Sales Pitch: How to Craft a Story to Stand Out and Win: ⁠https://www.amazon.com/Sales-Pitch-Craft-Story-Stand/dp/1999023021⁠ Postman: ⁠https://www.postman.com/⁠ What is Postman: ⁠https://www.postman.com/product/what-is-postman/⁠ The API platform landscape: ⁠https://blog.postman.com/2022-api-platform-landscape-trends-and-challenges/⁠ Gitlab Infinity: ⁠https://gitlab.com/infinity7x⁠ Salesforce Customer 360: ⁠https://www.salesforce.com/ap/blog/what-is-salesforce-customer-360/⁠ Obviously Awesome: How to Nail Product Positioning so Customers Get It, Buy It, Love It: ⁠https://www.amazon.com/Obviously-Awesome-Product-Positioning-Customers/dp/1999023005⁠ — Production and marketing by ⁠https://penname.co/

It's frustrating to see the widespread misuse of business terminology in the corporate world. Terms such as strategy, positioning, and vision are frequently interchanged or confused. Today, I'll clarify these terms, discussing when and how to use them. I’ll share with you: Thanks for listening! If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:17) How the book tour is going (01:02) A brief overview of vision, strategy, and positioning (04:02) The difference between pitching to investors and potential customers (06:30) How positioning evolves as your strategy progresses (07:18) How to use the “bowling pin” strategy (08:21) “Bowling pin” strategy examples from Janna Systems and Tulip Retail (13:51) Common pitfalls people make in discussing strategy (17:24) The importance of clarifying terminology with your team members (18:55) Closing thoughts — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Good Strategy Bad Strategy: The Difference and Why It Matters: https://www.amazon.com/Good-Strategy-Bad-Difference-Matters/dp/0307886239 Crossing the Chasm: Marketing and Selling Disruptive Products to Mainstream Customers: https://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Chasm-3rd-Disruptive-Mainstream/dp/0062292986 — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Every business wants to cash in on the latest trend, and for good reason. Trends can be powerful tools to enhance your positioning. However, it's crucial to recognize that not all trends are a universal fit for every company. Blindly adopting trends without thoughtful messaging can lead to disastrous outcomes for your business. Today, I’m diving deep into the world of trends. You’ll learn the following: Thanks for listening! — If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:27) Information about Sales Pitch and a reader’s review (01:19) The difference between markets and trends (04:34) How and when to layer trends on top of your differentiated value (06:36) The three circle mental model of product, market, and trend (07:38) How Redgate Software took advantage of the DevOps trend (09:50) Trends don’t always align with your product (and why you shouldn’t force them to) (13:41) Long Island Blockchain: an example of a company latching onto an unrelated trend (16:39) An overview of AI technology (18:28) The right way to address AI if it is relevant to your business and customers (19:42) Announcements — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Pantone: https://www.pantone.com/ Redgate Software: https://www.red-gate.com/ Long Island Iced Tea Soars After Changing Its Name to Long Blockchain: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-21/crypto-craze-sees-long-island-iced-tea-rename-as-long-blockchain — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today, I will talk about how to address your competition, which is commonly mismanaged. Once again, you’ll see it all comes back to positioning and differentiated value. I’ll share with you: Thanks for listening! — If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:21) How my book launch went (01:47) Addressing competition by putting them into buckets (03:43) Why market leaders should never mention the competition (05:03) Slack’s letter to Microsoft that named them as a competitor (09:16) DocuSign's ad mentioning Dropbox (10:36) Why you might build a custom landing page based on a search query (11:24) The benefit of naming the competition if you’re small (13:08) Positioning your competitors (16:57) Combating negative positioning from competitors (21:41) Closing thoughts — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Sales Pitch: How to Craft a Story to Stand Out and Win: https://www.amazon.com/Sales-Pitch-Craft-Story-Stand/dp/1999023021 Slack’s “Dear, Microsoft” letter: https://slack.com/blog/news/dear-microsoft — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

I get asked a lot by people about today’s topic on how to manage a positioning change within an organization. It applies to big and small companies and even those going through acquisitions. In today’s episode, I cover: I also want to mention my new book, Sales Pitch, is out! If you’d like to learn more or order a copy, you can go to https://www.aprildunford.com/books — If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:00) I launched my book and today’s topic (01:25) What happens when your positioning changes and specific examples (07:40) The unplanned reasons for why your positioning might change and how to check it (12:02) If you need to change your positioning, what you should do (15:10) How to be careful testing your new sales pitch (17:19) Why acquisitions require more work (24:51) The funniest thing I learned from going through 6 acquisitions (26:45) A few updates from me — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today, I’m joined by Bruno Aziza, who has an incredible background in data and technology and is a dear friend of mine. He has held previous positions at Google, Oracle, Microsoft, and AtScale. He’s currently a Partner at CapitalG, which is Alphabet's independent growth fund. In today’s episode, we cover: I’m very excited for you to listen. And by the way, my book has officially launched! You can order a copy of Sales Pitch by going to https://www.aprildunford.com/books — If You Want To Skip Ahead: (00:00) Meet my guest Bruno Aziza (01:50) Transitioning from a big company to a startup (06:59) Bruno’s big takeaways from his time at a successful startup (14:20) How Bruno applies the “center of design” concept to his thinking (21:00) Connecting with customer pain points (27:59) Lessons from leading Data & Analytics at Google Cloud (33:01) Handling workplace confrontation (35:24) Why being hyper-realistic is a great way to approach cross-functional meetings (38:18) Bruno’s role at CapitalG — Where To Find Bruno Aziza: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brunoaziza CarCast: https://tinyurl.com/TheCarCast Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: CapitalG: https://www.capitalg.com/ AtScale: https://www.atscale.com/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

My next book, Sales Pitch, is finally out! I’ve been working on this project for quite some time now and am beyond excited to share it with you all! If you’d like to support me and purchase the book, visit https://www.aprildunford.com/books to learn more. I’ve also included a free workbook on that page as well. Since my book came out this week, I figured today’s episode should be about why I wrote this book. I certainly didn’t start my career thinking I would end up helping so many businesses with their sales pitch, but here we are. In today’s episode, you’ll learn: Thank you again for supporting this podcast, my two books, and the other content I put out. — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Book launch week (00:57) My background in positioning and creating the sales pitch (07:25) IBM’s sales pitch structure (13:30) How April changed her approach after IBM (19:15) Why I got into sales pitches (24:45) My sales pitch structure (29:47) The book is here and how to get templates with the book — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Corporate Executive Board: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEB_Inc. The Challenger Sale: https://www.amazon.com/Challenger-Sale-Control-Customer-Conversation/dp/1591844355 The JOLT Effect: https://www.amazon.com/JOLT-Effect-Performers-Overcome-Indecision/dp/0593538102 — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today, I go deep on how to approach aligning your marketing and sales teams. It’s a topic I repeatedly hear most companies struggling with, and I’m excited to discuss the following: We’re getting so close to the launch of my next book, Sales Pitch! You can pre-order it today on Amazon with the links below: Amazon Canada Amazon USA Amazon UK — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Welcome and new book (01:05) Marketing and sales alignment (02:17) What is a good lead (06:10) How marketing builds sales pitches (09:05) Bringing marketing, sales, product, and executives together to craft positioning (13:40) Create a sales pitch testing protocol (20:19) Before you bring teams together, make sure you have structure — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today, I explore how to position your sales pitch storytelling arch. You’ll learn: not Don’t forget you can now pre-order my next book, Sales Pitch, on Amazon! If you’ve enjoyed the content I’ve been sharing, this is the most wonderful way for you to show your support. I sincerely appreciate it! Amazon Canada Amazon USA Amazon UK — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Today’s topic and book announcement (01:52) The initial sales pitch (04:30) Sales discovery (07:38) Starting with the problem (09:18) Change in the world (12:00) How to start your sales pitch (16:20) Leading with expertise (18:35) The sales pitch storytelling arch (22:20) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: ⁠⁠https://www.positioning.show/⁠⁠ Personal Website: ⁠⁠https://www.aprildunford.com/⁠⁠ LinkedIn: ⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/⁠⁠ Instagram: ⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/⁠⁠ Twitter: ⁠⁠https://twitter.com/aprildunford⁠⁠ TikTok: ⁠https://www.tiktok.com/@positioningshow⁠ — Production and marketing by ⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠

Today, I share everything you need to know about how to use positioning in your sales qualification and discovery. I discuss: Also, you can officially pre-order my next book, Sales Pitch, on Amazon! I’m incredibly proud of this book and can’t wait to share it with you. Here are the links for pre-order: Amazon Canada Amazon USA Amazon UK — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Intro and today’s topic (01:40) Sales and qualifying leads (06:07) The importance of quality (07:10) What is qualification (08:50) BANT criteria (11:38) A breakdown of discovery (13:20) My sales pitch structure (16:52) LevelJump example (21:18) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: ⁠https://www.positioning.show/⁠ Personal Website: ⁠https://www.aprildunford.com/⁠ LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/⁠ Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/⁠ Twitter: ⁠https://twitter.com/aprildunford⁠ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@positioningshow — Production and marketing by⁠ https://penname.co/⁠

Today’s episode is all about how to position startups and big companies. While there is some overlap, the two can be very different. I cover a lot of ground, including: — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Welcome to today’s show! (01:32) How to position for startups (05:43) Startups must try this (07:55) Investor pitch creep (10:00) Marketing vs positioning problems (13:25) Category creation for startups (15:00) How to position for big companies (19:20) Umbrella, division, and product positioning (23:20) Positioning after an acquisition (25:10) What isn’t different between the two (26:50) A big announcement — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I’m joined by Bob Moesta, the co-creator of the Jobs To Be Done framework, a concept he developed alongside the late Clayton Christensen. Bob's expertise spans a wide range of accomplishments, including the successful launch of over 3,500 new products, services, and businesses. He's also the CEO and founder of the Re-Wired Group, as well as the brains behind several other startup ventures. We discuss: I’m beyond excited for you to listen to today’s episode. You’ll also hear that my latest book is launching soon! If you want to find out more, you can sign up for email updates here https://www.aprildunford.com/books — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Our guest, Bob Moesta (04:50) What is jobs theory (08:49) The famous milkshake story (12:38) Competitive alternatives and their importance (15:36) Why the camera industry failed (17:01) How Intercom scaled massively (22:20) Always be problem aware first (24:12) Why positioning is about buying, not selling (29:20) Bob’s take on product market fit (35:01) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • Competing Against Luck: https://www.amazon.com/Competing-Against-Luck-Innovation-Customer/dp/0062435612 • Jobs To Be Done: https://hbr.org/2016/09/know-your-customers-jobs-to-be-done • Intercom: https://www.intercom.com/ • Disruptive Theory: https://hbr.org/2015/12/what-is-disruptive-innovation — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I dive deep into how to avoid bad marketing and sales and why sometimes this includes actively sharing who your product isn’t for. I go into greater detail about the following: Understanding that your product is only a part of your business How to craft great marketing and sales Why a formal positioning process impacts your sales and marketing strategy The core of sales and marketing is understanding your differentiated value How to build the story for your positioning — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Today’s topic: how to avoid terrible marketing and sales (01:55) Why thinking the product is the only thing is dangerous (03:35) Ask yourself this question (07:24) How to craft great marketing and sales (10:37) Understand your differentiated value (11:05) How to craft the story for your sales team (17:05) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Everybody Hates Marketers: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/everyone-hates-marketers/id1221256195 — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I cover how to know if you're getting good marketing and sales advice, and why it’s so important to carve your own path. I discuss: • What I learned from traditional marketing advice • Why traditional marketing advice falls short • The story of how a fax machine campaign became my best-performing initiative • Why you should not blindly follow popular marketing trends • The importance of figuring out what works for YOU — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) Today’s topic: how to know if you’re getting good marketing and sales advice (02:42) What I learned from traditional marketing education (06:46) Specific examples of how traditional marketing education falls short (13:52) Why you should be wary of blanket statements (15:47) The story of how a fax machine campaign became our best-performing initiative (26:14) How to decipher good vs bad marketing advice (32:34) Why I’m always careful in the advice I give — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • Chrysler: https://www.chrysler.com/ • Volvo: https://www.volvocars.com/us • Pepsi: https://www.pepsi.com/ • Liquid Death: https://liquiddeath.com/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I explore developing a point of view for your business. I cover: — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) How to develop a point of view for your business (03:07) How Sampler built a point of view for their market (06:20) What if you don’t know your point of view (09:00) Why features don’t matter (10:11) How IBM handled its own point of view (15:15) How to apply point of view in sales and marketing (17:38) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: Sampler https://www.sampler.io/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Today I dive into what to do with your positioning once you’ve nailed it. I cover: • How to capture positioning • How positioning makes its way into messaging • Why you should create a messaging document and what ends up happening if you don’t • What the market needs in order to understand our differentiated value • How to go from positioning to branding • How to take boilerplate messaging and apply it globally — If you want to skip ahead: (00:00) How to put your new positioning to use (01:00) A quick recap of building and testing your positioning (02:48) The messaging document (05:00) Messaging drift (06:13) The contents of the messaging document (07:24) Who should own the messaging document (08:03) How changes should be approached (12:38) Helping customers understand your POV (15:08) LevelJump’s calculator example (17:27) Postman example (19:50) How to go from positioning to branding (24:10) How to take boilerplate messaging and apply it globally (27:34) Proof of value and the importance of local proof (28:46) An example where core positioning varied regionally (30:11) Thanks for listening — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Referenced: • LevelJump: https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/leveljump • Postman: https://www.postman.com/ — Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

I sat down with Nick Francis, the Co-Founder and CEO of Help Scout. A few years ago I worked directly with Nick and his team to tighten up their positioning and brought him on to share their story. Together we discuss: • What the positioning of Help Scout looked like during the early days • How their positioning evolved over time • Why they utilized outside help • How he took the sales narrative he worked on with me and turned it into a pitch • How their strategy has changed as they’ve moved upmarket — In This Episode, I Cover: (00:00) About my guest, Nick Francis (02:05) The origin story of Help Scout (04:50) How Techstars informed their messaging early on (06:00) How they differentiated themselves from other help desk companies (08:28) Where early inbound customers came from (09:58) Copycat competitors, and how Help Scout thinks about competition (11:57) Identifying key differentiators (13:20) Why they decided to bring in outside help (me) and what they learned (15:29) The evolution of their sales pitch (18:42) Why you should always test your sales pitch first (20:27) Who was responsible for building the sales pitch (21:24) Signals it was time to revisit the pitch (24:58) The future of Help Scout (26:27) How the product itself reinforces their positioning (28:42) How their strategy has changed as they’ve moved upmarket (30:17) Why positioning is so important — Where To Find April Dunford: Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/ Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford — Where To Find Nick Francis: Website: http://nickfranc.is/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nickfrancis1/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/nickfrancis?lang=en — Referenced: • Help Scout: https://www.helpscout.com/ • Techstars: https://www.techstars.com/ • David Cohen: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgcohen/ • Zendesk: https://www.zendesk.com/ • Intercom: https://www.intercom.com/ • Front: https://front.com/ Production and marketing by https://penname.co/