When the Flames Go Up

We have limited data on this, but based on a sample size of one we can confirm that the second first anniversary is a lot more fun than the first. It turns out that—once you’ve set aside the burden of synthetic romance—it’s really great to relax and chat about how we manage to pilot our little boats through the riptides of middle age. After 44 episodes, 36 guests, and one remarriage, we’ve also determined that our primary apprehensions fall into four basic buckets: our bodies, our parents, our kids, and our overall mental wellbeing. And if you’re lucky, two of those buckets aren’t leaking all over your hardwood flooring. We’ve had some frank discussions about some really tough topics like estrangement, dementia, college, injury, and the Big Inevitable: grief. But sharing the collective experience has made us feel closer to our age cohort and more equipped to deal with whatever shock to the system is lurking around the corner. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also delve into Doug’s debilitating trust issues, assert that ChatGPT wipes the floor with Google Translate, and urge America Ferrara to run for president. Other links: * Why writing by hand beats typing for thinking and learning * Sofia Vergara’s adventures with English dialogue * Age ranges for the demographic “generations” * A recurring favorite: “Mr. Zero knew.” * Jodie Ousley’s blog on Medium * Hat tip to Ocean’s Twelve This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

We talk a lot on this show about the stresses of the Sandwich Generation, especially when a parent or child has a chronic condition that needs a lot of care. But what if you’re the primary breadwinner, your kids require a lot of medical attention, and you’ve got a debilitating chronic condition of your own? After four years of treatment for Long COVID, Heather Petit knows a lot about that. And though she has every reason to wallow in despair and/or scowl at the heavens, she personifies the importance of being “a ‘what’s next?’ person” who has had a lot of practice advocating for herself in doctors’ offices. The key is to collect data about her symptoms and present it as straightforwardly as possible, as a journalist would. It’s an odd thing to experiment on your own body as often as she has to, trying this pill and that diet to determine which ones generate the most energy and alleviate the most pain. But she does it because she’s genuinely interested, she’s lucky enough to have a lot of support, and the only alternative is to roll over and die (which, thanks to the example of her 89-year-old mother who invented Will Drills, ain’t gonna happen). Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. Heather goes deep about how lungs work and many of the symptoms she’s treated, and she shares a lot of resources that have kept her informed, focused, and optimistic. We also talk about what it’s like when you can’t yawn, the healthful properties of soft pretzels and margaritas, and why it took six months to change her name to her name. Other links: * Welcome to “the most cozy-feeling book of all time” * How to spell dyspnea * The multisystem impact of Long COVID * What Long COVID investigators can learn from four decades of ME/CFS research * The multidisciplinary management of long COVID (and its accompanying management table) * Munchausen Syndrome (otherwise known as factitious disorder) * Join the Long COVID Choir for respiratory therapy * We’re all living the horror of The Fly, in one form or another This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

As fate would have it, this publication day happens to coincide with the 25-year anniversary of the day we got married. So we decided to devote an episode to get a little real and remember what we were really feeling while it all went down dooby-doo down down. The episode’s cover art is an image on the front of a wedding album that Doug’s sister made for us, and it’s kind of eerily prophetic that all the wedding finery is laid out without any people in it. We’ve had a lot of time to think about why we did what we did, and airing it like this feels like the last in a series of “closure moments.” Did we get together for a lot of embarrassingly wrong reasons? You betcha. Do we get a little snippy with each other? A little. But we also know how much we’ve tried to figure out how to cooperate for our boys, and it all started by realizing you can’t have a great relationship with your ex until they’re your ex. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also talk about how it must feel to resurrect a romance several years after it ended, the macabre feeling of brewing stock with your old hip, and whether it’s ever a good idea to show your ex your avocados. Other links: * Baby Blues, a boy’s podcast, and a hairbrush * Kali, the goddess of destruction (and lots of other things) * Jim Carrey’s speech about pursuing what you love * When Harry Met Sally …: Harry bumps into Helen Hillson … and Ira * The Graduate: What happens after Ben and Elaine run off together? * Stranger Than Fiction: “I’ve written papers on little did he know.” * Four Weddings and A Funeral: “I never expected the Thunderbolt.” * Roy Kent: “Don’t you dare settle for ‘fine’.” * Edvard Munch’s “Love and Pain,” later referred to as “Vampire” This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

If there’s a common theme to the separate adventures we had over last weekend, it’s probably Attempts to Defy Cultural Reinforcement. Magda took our son to an Accepted Student event and met parents who wanted to know how promptly the school responds to phone calls. Because modern parents still feel compelled to fly our helicopters onto campuses and advocate for our kids in a chaotic world. Meanwhile, Doug wondered if road-tripping to bourbon country with an “activity buddy” might elevate the rapport to a closer friendship. Because the prevailing wisdom is that a lot of men—especially middle-aged men—sidestep intimacy and therefore have a difficult time making new friends. Amid the thunderstorms, car-accident traffic, and eggplant rollatini, the weekend offered up some valuable revelations. Doug’s new friend had a painful story to tell and knows the value of being able to tell it. Colleges build cafeterias that look like Hedwig might fly in any minute. And once you have your first egg salad sandwich with smoked mayo, you won’t go back. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also talk about attending the Boston Marathon on Patriots’ Day, finding new subscribers in bars (Hi, Kelly!), and why refueling an EV requires a little foreplay. Previous episodes referenced: Other links: * Behold the low-riding majesty of the Lucid Air EV. * Jess was worth the wagon-wheel coffee table. * Bardstown hosts the annual Kentucky Bourbon Festival. * Why Gen Z is more open to talking about mental health * “A towel is about the most massively useful thing an interstellar hitchhiker can have.” This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

After creating the “accidental empire” Scary Mommy, Jill Smokler is ready to go deep with her new project, She’s Got Issues—a site devoted to helping women navigate midlife. And she wasn’t afraid to go deep with us about her apprehensions about eldercare, why her marriage failed (and not just because her ex-husband is gay), and the challenge of adapting her skills and strategies for modern media. Jill’s youngest child will graduate high school right as her parents turn 80, so she’s thinking a lot about the opportunities and responsibilities that are waiting for her. Her experience as a younger mom may have inspired a logo full of “snakes and lions and blood and daggers,” but in the context of her new business partnership and her all-too-public divorce, that image seems a little tame. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also talk about skepticism over couples counseling, the singular weirdness of candle salad, and that time she made up an assistant to perform triage on editorial pitches. Other links * Follow Jill on Instagram and Threads * Read Jill’s best-selling book, Confessions of a Scary Mommy * The Edgarbug craves “Sugar … in water.” This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

This episode arrives during what feels like a very weird confluence of confluences. Mercury went back into retrograde on April Fool’s Day (the same day when Germany legalized weed). The Great American Eclipse—which every U.S. state will at least partially experience—will occur the day after the moon reaches perigee, its closest orbit distance to Earth. And next month, billions of double-brood cicadas will rise up like bug zombies and eat Illinois, for the first time since before Illinois became a state. How’re we supposed to concentrate on mundane things like Schedule C’s when it’s so much more fun to contemplate why all these phenomena might be related? It’s enough to make you read about something Ron DeSantis stands for and not be completely disgusted by it. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! We’re a listener-supported enterprise, so please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also manage to skate around a bunch of other loosely-related topics, like religion, that emoji Connections puzzle, Match Game, when science fiction is just too unbelievable, and how great it is that a writer named Lisa Stardust anchors the Today Show’s astrology coverage. Other links: * The enduring influence of Ames and Ilg * How Wyna Liu writes Connections * How Michael Chabon solves Connections * The rebus puzzles of Classic Concentration This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

We’ve talked a lot on this podcast about our parents’ impact on our lives, mostly in the context of supervising their eldercare and/or grieving their loss. But this conversation with Amanda Magee is our first to delve into how it feels to stop all contact with your parents, especially when your kids start aging out of the household. Any fundamental change in an intimate relationship leaves a mark, regardless of how it comes about. And during this turbulent time among the three generations, she relies on several creative pursuits—writing, music, set design, and entrepreneurship among them—to help keep her train on the rails. Amanda speaks frankly about adjusting to motherhood, building her parental self on her own terms, and how her three daughters, raised in the age of social media, have learned that when someone knocks, it’s OK not to answer the door. And we almost got to the end without mentioning menopause! Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting. We also talk about maintaining a business with your spouse for 20 years, the perfect simplicity of the Tug Rule, and the children’s book about The Secret Pee that needs to happen. Other links: * Follow Amanda on Instagram and TikTok * The abiding influence of Kate & Allie * All Of Us Strangers has arrived on Hulu * Blown away by THX and Maxell tapes * Why we love Sally O’Malley * Ride the Black Fly Challenge * The potential havoc caused by the piriformis muscle This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

After a week off, we’ve got a lot of ground to cover. But the standard conversational deviations into The Price Is Right, Rush lyrics, and why ADHD affects your ankle bones serve a subtle purpose as therapy for Doug, who is living alone—like alone-alone, not the-kids-will-be-back-next-week alone—for the first time since 1987. Empty nesting can feel different for single people, especially when your family and best friends are all hundreds of miles away. When the nostalgia and excitement collide, the energy of the impact can launch a spate of “grief cleaning,” when you jettison a lot of stuff and rearrange whatever’s left. Ultimately, a lot of our success as 50-plus-year-olds stems from our ability to handle change, which seems to come at us with more substance and less warning than before. It’s usually easier said than done, especially while you’re sifting through the artifacts of a formerly all-consuming way of life that is well and rightly over. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and sorting through layers of sentimental sediment. We also tackle several important questions of our time: Is there such a thing as a free market? Is 50 a good age to start an undergraduate education? And are the benefits of yoga enough to offset all the farting? Other links: * “We better get going if we want to stay ahead of the weather.” * Congress passed 27 bills in 2023, the fewest in decades. * Changes aren’t permanent, but change is. * Another way to blow off some nervous energy? Get on your bike. Episodes referenced: This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

As a mother of twins and self-described overthinker, began planning for sending her daughters off to college “on the way home from the gynecologist’s office.” So when the house was suddenly empty again, she was ready. She was taught to embrace change as an opportunity by her dynamic parents—a mom who’s working on her eighth book and a dad who’s still processing the medical accident that paralyzed his leg. That intermediate downsizing a few years ago was a bitch, but it was worth it. Like told us in Episode 16, Laurie is finding her creative center in her 50s, having transitioned from a graphic design business owner to a full-time artist. And after a couple years of self-schooling, she’s playing bass and singing in Channeling Granny, her band that debuted last night. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and appreciation for hot bass licks. We also talk about the late, lamented Draw Something app, the post-menopausal miracle that restored her oenophilia, and firsthand proof of what Mad Men got wrong about agency creatives. Other links: * Follow Laurie on Instagram * March 4 was National Sons Day * CODA YouTuber John Urquhardt * Daniel Tammet, the Brain Man (and the subsequent documentary) * The Artist’s Way program, with Julia Cameron * Myst has been updated! * From : the wisdom of E.B. White This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

With Washington’s birthday and the Michigan presidential primary freshly concluded, listen in as Magda regales us with her meteoric rise from tenderfooted poll worker to precinct chairperson! Witness the palace intrigue! The moral relativism among desperate foes! The unquenchable resolve of a willful ingenue who stepped on any neck she had to in order to plant her flag in the fetid mud pit of Detroit politics! (Actually, she just answered an ad and kept showing up.) A lot of us get involved in politics when we realize we have the time, desire, and fortititude to fight for the change we want to see. But the most important thing to consider before you intiate contact is to assess what you’re prepared to do and where that effort is most needed. There might be a candidate or ballot proposition that needs your support, but in Magda’s case the biggest need was getting people to the polls and helping them understand the ballot once they got there. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and saving democracy one new voter at a time. In this episode, Magda offers up some Inside Baseball about how she was trained and how that training prepared her for an 18-hour day, from set-up to takedown. We discuss how early voting, straight-ticket voting, and absentee voting work. After which you will understand why she’s been destined for this work since she was four years old. Other links: * The Michigan primary results were predictable, but the general will be a whole new ballgame. * Are you involved in local politics? Or do you have a question for Magda about getting involved? Start a thread in our Facebook group. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

There are no easy answers when you’re “Deep in The Dagwood” of sandwich parenting. When you’re looking after your wheelchair-bound mom and 90-year-old stepdad, your siblings don’t live locally, you have a full-time job, and you want to model competence for your teenage daughters without perpetuating the thought that holding families together defaults to the women. Helen Jane Hearn does all of these things, three years after her family moved across the country—and across a broad political and cultural divide—to take over her childhood home in rural Wisconsin. Adjusting to bigger responsibilities and smaller social circles hasn’t been easy, but those responsibilities gather importance when she remembers they won’t last forever. Plus: her kids love the outdoors, and they’re having valuable conversations that might not have happened back in wine country. Basically, she isn’t afraid to use “FML” to assess her situation—as long as it means “foxy, middle-aged lady.” Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and gnawing our way out of a Dagwood. We also talk about the compelling allure of a tiny apartment with no stuff, the cultural significance of Take Your Tractor to School Day, and why duct tape should be Wisconsin’s state flower. Other links: * Follow Helen Jane on Instagram and Pinterest * Why Toledo is in Ohio and not Michigan * Date Night, with Steve Carell and Tina Fey * Important information about being a Yooper This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

Magda and Doug are each at a point where it’s time to make some new real-life, face-to-face friends: Magda because she has moved across the country to live with her husband, and Doug because he is a man. And really, how hard could it be? All you have to do is live in a place where at least a few like-minded people are, find the places where those like-minded people hang out, be at least a little bit extroverted (or convince yourself you can be, in short bursts), be forthright but not thirsty, have a plan but be flexible, be innovative but follow a lot of well-traveled advice—and set aside the unnerving thought that a lot of people are just straight-up weird. Don’t believe the pessimists! Friendship after fifty is definitely possible. On top of all the options you can find anywhere online—volunteering, continuing ed, friendship apps, etc.—we talk about some specific, slightly eccentric examples that worked wonderfully. And with less effort than you might think. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and keeeping faith in humanity. We also answer several burning questions: Is being friends after you get divorced always a good thing? Is there such a thing as hopeful cynicism? And do you really have to kiss a lot of people dressed as frogs? Other links: * Usher’s “boop-boop” song * The Whoever vs. Who Cares Super Bowl cake * Travis Kelce goes berserk on his coach * Don’t be the “get in the hole!” guy * Chris Stevens predicted the isolation of technology 30 years ago * John Laroche moves on from loving fish * Hijab Butch Blues by Lamya H * Find your people on Bumble for Friends Former episode mentioned: This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

Magda and Doug are each at a point where it’s time to make some new real-life, face-to-face friends: Magda because she has moved across the country to live with her husband, and Doug because he is a man. And really, how hard could it be? All you have to do is live in a place where at least a few like-minded people are, find the places where those like-minded people hang out, be at least a little bit extroverted (or convince yourself you can be, in short bursts), be forthright but not thirsty, have a plan but be flexible, be innovative but follow a lot of well-traveled advice—and set aside the unnerving thought that a lot of people are just straight-up weird. Don’t believe the pessimists! Friendship after fifty is definitely possible. On top of all the options you can find anywhere online—volunteering, continuing ed, friendship apps, etc.—we talk about some specific, slightly eccentric examples that worked wonderfully. And with less effort than you might think. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and keeeping faith in humanity. We also answer several burning questions: Is being friends after you get divorced always a good thing? Is there such a thing as hopeful cynicism? And do you really have to kiss a lot of people dressed as frogs? Other links: * Usher’s “boop-boop” song * The Whoever vs. Who Cares Super Bowl cake * Travis Kelce goes berserk on his coach * Don’t be the “get in the hole!” guy * Chris Stevens predicted the isolation of technology 30 years ago * John Laroche moves on from loving fish * Hijab Butch Blues by Lamya H * Find your people on Bumble for Friends Former episode mentioned: This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

A lot of people our age are grieving the abrupt death of one parent and taking on sole caregiving responsibility for the other. Some have endured a bitter custody battle (or two) after a breakup and built a business around their experiences. Some have had children later in life and know the fatigue of chasing after a grade-schooler. Jessica Ashley came on our podcast to talk about what it’s like to do all that at once. It’s easy to get angry over relationships that go sour, or misogyny in the family court system, or how “kin keeping” so often defaults to the daughters. But Jessica has learned to filter those thoughts through her Master’s degree in women’s studies, use it when she needs it, and offload it when the needle is in the red. Above all, she feels like a more centered parent, who wants to show her 9-year-old daughter that ”always knowing you can choose yourself feels good and healthy.” Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and fighting wars on multiple fronts. We also talk about how not to blame yourself when a relationship you really believed in goes awry, how a psychic helped balance her emotional ledger, and why we should all be lucky enough to end up like the Golden Girls. Other links: * Follow Jessica on TikTok * Jessica’s book: The Blended Family Q&A * The mysteriously acronymed CSS financial aid form Other WTFGU episodes referenced: This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

FAFSA stands for Free Application for Federal Student Aid, and given all the problems with rolling out its update, another f-word is conspicuously missing. Determining financial aid is intricately interwoven into the admissions calendar, but yesterday’s news that FAFSA data won’t be available until mid-March—which we learned after we recorded this episode—means a lot of admissions decisions will be made with far less information than usual. The site’s availability was already pushed back almost three months because of the FAFSA Simplification Act (HAHAHAHAHA!). But now the DoE has to clean up a big accounting boo-boo, which would have reduced the amount of awarded financial aid by 1.8 billion dollars. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and wrestling with federal bureaucracy. Many listeners have contacted us about how to cope with this pervasive mess, so we’re starting a forum about it in our Facebook group. Since it’s so hard to find definitive answers—even from admissions professionals who are just as perplexed as we are—we’re building a repository of shared information to help us all row through these choppy waters. We hope it will be a way to stay current, to relay good and bad experiences, and to commiserate when the next thing goes sideways. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

When you think about a quintessential Fifties Moment, Bill Braine’s 55th birthday checks a lot of boxes. At the midpoint of his 50s, he was recovering from hip replacement surgery, adjusting to his new CPAP machine, and negotiating intently with his parents to downsize and de-clutter. He was also continuing his now-14-year tradition of mapping out his annual goals with his adapted method of Getting Things Done, a mural-sized type of bullet journal that helped keep him on task to write his first novel, Bone Hollow. If you’ve considered treating a bum hip or sleep apnea, Bill offers reassuring details and advice for each. You can deny your hip pain for years, but sometimes a very loving partner has to show you how mundane hip replacements are (his doctor replaced nine that day). And they’ll even mail you your femur for conversion into any number of objets d’art! Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and replacement of our body parts. We also talk about the entertainment value of Dull Men, the irony of AI robots that watch you sleep, and how turning 50 is all about appreciating life’s minutiae. Other links: * Follow Bill on Mastodon * Meet Bill on January 30 as he discusses his novel in Cornwall, NY * Learn more about pączki * How to stretch your hip flexors with an inversion table * Podcaster and writer Merlin Mann * Self-publish with Lulu.com * When Liz Lemon thought organizing would make her wonderful This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

When you think about a quintessential Fifties Moment, Bill Braine’s 55th birthday checks a lot of boxes. At the midpoint of his 50s, he was recovering from hip replacement surgery, adjusting to his new CPAP machine, and negotiating intently with his parents to downsize and de-clutter. He was also continuing his now-14-year tradition of mapping out his annual goals with his adapted method of Getting Things Done, a mural-sized type of bullet journal that helped keep him on task to write his first novel, Bone Hollow. If you’ve considered treating a bum hip or sleep apnea, Bill offers reassuring details and advice for each. You can deny your hip pain for years, but sometimes a very loving partner has to show you how mundane hip replacements are (his doctor replaced nine that day). And they’ll even mail you your femur for conversion into any number of objets d’art! Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and replacement of our body parts. We also talk about the entertainment value of Dull Men, the irony of AI robots that watch you sleep, and how turning 50 is all about appreciating life’s minutiae. Other links: * Follow Bill on Mastodon * Meet Bill on January 30 as he discusses his novel in Cornwall, NY * Learn more about pączki * How to stretch your hip flexors with an inversion table * Podcaster and writer Merlin Mann * Self-publish with Lulu.com * When Liz Lemon thought organizing would make her wonderful This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

This episode is an experiment. Our primary goal for this podcast is and always will be to learn more about our mid-lives, helped by the expertise and experiences our guests offer up. And we’ve got lots of chat partners lined up over the next several weeks to do that. Sometimes, though, we learn by doing what we’ve done best since we met in 1996: killing a cold afternoon with hot coffee, talking about anything and everything until one of us notices it’s gotten dark outside. We had all the chat time in the world over the weekend, since Magda was back in Michigan and the thermometer read -6°. We rejoiced that Northern Exposure reruns have finally emerged from the morass of licensing disputes and decided the vivid backstories of the older characters are much more interesting than those whiny 20-somethings. We realized that the 25th anniversary of the day we got married is coming up in April. And there were interesting revelations about frostbite, Jesus, kombucha, the unpredictable human heart, and when perimenopause give you “brain zaps.” Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and resistance to brain zaps. Thanks for playing along with us and listening to this thing. When the Flames Go Up is all about the surprises of our 50s, and one of the great surprises of our 50s is that, after we split, we could ever reclaim the friendship we found back in the 1900s and just sit and chat like we used to. Links: * Homeland Security consulted science fiction writers about potential future threats * Internet Brands wants you to please return to in-person work, or else (video here) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

This episode is an experiment. Our primary goal for this podcast is and always will be to learn more about our mid-lives, helped by the expertise and experiences our guests offer up. And we’ve got lots of chat partners lined up over the next several weeks to do that. Sometimes, though, we learn by doing what we’ve done best since we met in 1996: killing a cold afternoon with hot coffee, talking about anything and everything until one of us notices it’s gotten dark outside. We had all the chat time in the world over the weekend, since Magda was back in Michigan and the thermometer read -6°. We rejoiced that Northern Exposure reruns have finally emerged from the morass of licensing disputes and decided the vivid backstories of the older characters are much more interesting than those whiny 20-somethings. We realized that the 25th anniversary of the day we got married is coming up in April. And there were interesting revelations about frostbite, Jesus, kombucha, the unpredictable human heart, and when perimenopause give you “brain zaps.” Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and resistance to brain zaps. Thanks for playing along with us and listening to this thing. When the Flames Go Up is all about the surprises of our 50s, and one of the great surprises of our 50s is that, after we split, we could ever reclaim the friendship we found back in the 1900s and just sit and chat like we used to. Links: * Homeland Security consulted science fiction writers about potential future threats * Internet Brands wants you to please return to in-person work, or else (video here) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com

It’s our first podcast episode of 2024! And we’re greeting the new year with a discussion with writer Jeff Bogle about holidays, death, serendipity, literature, and cats. It’s a difficult episode to encapsulate in one blurb, so let’s try three: * Late last year, Jeff randomly tweeted an idea for a book and walked away a month later with a literary agent and a deal for “Street Cats and Where to Find Them.” The manuscript is due in July. * Christmas has always been a huge holiday for Jeff’s extended family, and they’re still trying to find the new rhythm after his father and brother died. * At 48, Jeff discovered an unexpected passion when he started his Stanchion literary zine, which for its latest issue received 1,800 submissions in 24 hours. In order to travel the world to make this book come together, all while publishing Stanchion and being the primary parental contact for his teenage daughter, he’s going to need a lot of help from his mom, his ex-wife, and his wife-wife. He might not be 50 years old yet, but he’s living through a lot of a 50-year-old’s reality. Thanks for listening to When the Flames Go Up! Please consider a paid subscription to support our writing and podcasting and conjuring book deals out of the ether. We also talk about mocktails and sober entertaining, having your widowed mom as your downstairs neighbor, and being weirdly passionate enough to drive 20 roundtrip hours for a hockey game. Other links: * Follow Jeff on Instagram (OWTK used to stand for Out With the Kids) * Follow Stanchion on Instagram * Watch “Kedi,” the documentary about street cats in Istanbul This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit whentheflamesgoup.substack.com