Climbing Business Journal Podcasts

Today’s episode of the Impact Driver Podcast welcomes Zoey Grinstead (she/they), Los Angeles-based routesetter and Queer Crush founder, to the recording studio. In a sport that prides itself on counter-cultural roots and community values, the gap between that identity and lived reality for many climbers is still very much worth talking about. The question of who belongs in routesetting—and who feels like they don’t—has arguably never been more urgent. Zoey brings a grounded, no-nonsense perspective on identity, community, and creative expression in routesetting to this week’s conversation, as she and Holly Chen discuss all these topics as well as tips for fostering inclusion. Zoey is a routesetter at Touchstone Climbing in Los Angeles, where she has been part of the team for nearly 15 years, starting as a belay staff member before finding her way to the setting closet. With over a decade of setting experience, Zoe has worked in commercial and competition settings alike, including notable events like Death Moth in 2026 and multiple Women Up competitions. She holds a USAC Level 2 certification and is a former president of Queer Crush, a nonprofit dedicated to holding space for the queer community within climbing. Beyond the gym, Zoe is currently a student. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramTouchstone Climbingthe Woman Up Climbing FestivalKeep Them Sketched Out – Impact Driver Podcast with Claire Kawainui MillerDeath Moth Climbing CompetitionQueer Crush ClimbingBolt & Revolt Setting CoalitionBrown Girls ClimbCruxing in ColorFlash FoxyPath of a Routesetter (updated)Routesetting Level Prerequisites Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. You can find our pitch form here. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Rúngne, Climbing Wall Association, Cascade Specialty, Trango and Rock Gym Pro. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and Joe Robinson, and our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

In this week’s episode, Scott Rennak sits down with Marc Norman, CEO of USA Climbing, who has been in this role for eight years and came to it with unique credentials. Previously, Marc spent two decades at the Utah Olympic Legacy Foundation, finishing as VP of Sport and Venues—overseeing three Olympic facilities, 300 employees, and the kind of large-scale operations that come with hosting some of the world's biggest sporting events. He was also a competitive athlete and has a lifelong love of climbing that dates back to a Wisconsin crag in the early ‘90s. During their conversation, Marc and Scott dig into some deep topics within competition climbing today. They cover USA Climbing's ambitious National Training Center project in Salt Lake City—including the partnership with Momentum, the community pushback, and how the facility is being designed to serve athletes. They also explore the youth athlete pipeline, how climbing can capitalize on its LA 2028 Olympic moment (including paraclimbing's debut on the Paralympic program), and what it's going to take for the whole industry to convert that exposure into real foot traffic and long-term growth. General Topics Covered Show Notes USA ClimbingUSAC National Training CenterUSAC Strategic PlanningClimbing at LA28Marc Norman on Linkedin Thank you Cascade Specialty, Climbing Wall Association, Rúngne, Rock Gym Pro and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s guest is Zuoyi (pronounced: Zoe) Phang, a routesetter based in Durham, North Carolina, and a member of the setting team at Triangle Rock Club. Zuoyi began climbing in 2018 after a friend invited her to a gym birthday party and she quickly “fell down the rabbit hold,” climbing nearly every day while balancing long shifts in the service industry. Not long after, she was recruited into routesetting and has been building her experience ever since, working across multiple Triangle Rock Club locations and setting USA Climbing events across the Southeast. Notably, Zuoyi has also set for Siege the Southeast. Zuoyi is a USA Climbing Level 2 routesetter with plans to step into her first chief roles in the near future. In this episode, Zuoyi and host Holly Chen dive into the human side of routesetting: the emotions that come with creative work, the role ego plays in the craft, and how team members can support each other through the inevitable frictions of collaborative setting. General Topics Covered Show Notes Zuoyi PhangTriangle Rock ClubSiege ClimbingAn Episode of Affirmations: Battling Imposter Syndrome with Ethan Paris Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. You can find our pitch form here. The Impact Driver Podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Rúngne, Cascade Specialty, Trango, Approach and Onsite. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and Joe Robinson, and our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

In this episode, Scott Rennak interviews Brett Jessen, the Head of Climbing Environments at Bouldering Project. Brett talks about his extensive journey in the climbing industry, from his early days as a climber and routesetter in the ‘90s to his current role in building cutting-edge climbing gyms. He discusses the evolution of climbing gyms, the design and construction process, and the importance of community and culture in climbing. Brett also offers valuable advice for aspiring gym owners and reflects on the future of the climbing industry. General Topics Covered Show Notes Bouldering ProjectCBJ article about St. Paul BP Thank you Rúngne, Approach, Essential, Flashed, and OnSite for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s guest is Jeremy Ho, who many know as JHo, one of the most recognizable names in the U.S. setting community. Jeremy has worked in the climbing industry since 2007, primarily as a routesetter, and has been a National Routesetter with USA Climbing since 2012. He now serves as USAC's National Routesetting Program Manager, helping shape education, pathways, and standards across the country. Previously, Jeremy was Director of Routesetting at Touchstone Climbing and Sportrock Climbing Centers, and he has set events ranging from USAC Team Trials and Open Bouldering Nationals to Bouldering World Cups and North American Cup Series competitions. Jeremy and host Holly Chen dive into leadership, development, and the realities of building a sustainable national routesetting pipeline in this episode. General Topics Covered Show Notes Jeremy HoUSA Climbing Routesetter Resources USA Climbing Routesetter PathwayAmy Stone Foundation Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. You can find our pitch form here. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Rúngne, Approach, Essential, Onsite and Flashed. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and Joe Robinson, and our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today’s episode is a rare interview with Anne-Worley Moelter, one of the most accomplished and experienced professionals in the climbing industry. Currently she serves as CEO of Movement Climbing Gyms, the largest chain of climbing gyms in the world. But her start in our industry began over 25 years ago in Colorado, when she was a manager at Boulder’s first full climbing gym. She later co-founded the first Movement location with her husband Mike Moelter, after spending half a decade as USA Climbing’s first Executive Director. She’s also currently a Vice President of World Climbing, formerly the International Federation of Sport Climbing. Through her wealth of experience, Anne-Worley has learned a lot about our industry, careers, personal and professional motivations for climbing, and much more. In this episode she sits down with Scott to share her insights, from leadership wisdom to stewardship guidance and beyond. General Topics Covered Show Notes Movement Climbing GymsMovement InstagramCBJ Article Thank you Rúngne, Rock Gym Pro, Kilter, Strati Climbing and Trango for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Today’s guest brings us back full circle to our first-ever episode of the Impact Driver Podcast, as we welcome Sierra McMurry (they/them) back to the show after two years. Sierra has been climbing for over a decade and routesetting for nearly as long, working at commercial gyms and competitions as a contract setter while balancing life as a PhD candidate in wildlife biology at North Carolina State University. Frequently traveling between the East and West, Sierra brings a wide range of setting styles and team experiences into every room they enter. They are a USAC Level 2 routesetter, with a growing focus on competition setting, education, and building safer, more inclusive pathways into the profession. Sierra and Holly dive into all those topics and more on CBJ’s first video podcast episode. General Topics Covered Show Notes Sierra McMurryPh.D PortfolioSierra McMurry – Routesetting on Common and Uncommon Ground Routesetting Tips and Workflow feat. Sierra McMurry Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. You can find our pitch form here. The Impact Driver Podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Rungne, Trango, Rock Gym Pro, Flashed and Onsite. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and Joe Robinson, and our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

The USA Climbing competition season is well underway and athletes are showing up to qualification events across the country. On this episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen invites former USAC Routesetting Director Mike Bockino to chat all about competition setting. Mike is someone who needs no introduction, but we’re going to introduce him anyway. Climbing since 1999 and setting commercially since 2009, Mike estimates that he has set over 150 competitions, including 28 National Championships and 6 World Cups. He bounced between Salt Lake City and Boise in his early setting days before landing at The Front Climbing Club, where he eventually became the Director of Setting. In 2020, he became USA Climbing’s Routesetting Director. Mike left that position in 2025 to join Essential Climbing. He is a USAC Level 5 National Head Routesetter, an IFSC Level 2 Routesetter, and a certified strength coach. When Mike is not setting or climbing, he enjoys making restaurant-grade tomato sauce. General Topics Covered Show Notes Mike BockinoEssential Climbing Welcomes Mike Bockino to the TeamMike’s blog Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. You can find our pitch form here. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Approach and Butora. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today's episode features an interview with Parker Sims, founder of Gravity Bear, a new bouldering gym built inside a century-old, renovated building in downtown Tulsa, Oklahoma. Parker talks with host John Burgman about the process it took to bring this ambitious project to life, from managing construction timelines and subcontractors to refining the gym’s vision around a “minimum-viable-product” approach. Throughout the conversation, Parker shares the challenges of acting as his own project manager, the importance of hiring the right team early, and how the gym’s design evolved to balance financial reality with addressing community needs. He also explains how his military background shaped his leadership style and resilience through the ups and downs of construction. Listeners will hear how Parker drew inspiration from climbing gyms around the world, blending a European-style, café culture with a focus on creating a community gathering space and true “third place” for locals and visitors alike. Tune in to learn how Gravity Bear came together—one deadline, renovation and lesson at a time. General Topics Covered Show Notes @climbgravitybear Thank you Approach and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

As the routesetting field continues to become more professionalized, so do our standards and expectations. On this episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen talks with Colorado-based routesetter Daniel Cornella about the state of routesetting education and the elements of good competition sport routes. Dan first discovered climbing thanks to his high school biology teacher, took a detour to serve in the Marines in California, and eventually found his way back to the Colorado climbing scene. In 2013, he was introduced to routesetting at Life Time Fitness by Matt Lloyd. If you’ve climbed in a Colorado gym in the last decade—from the iconic 90s-era gym Rock’n & Jam’n (now The Spot Thornton) to various Movement locations—chances are you’ve pulled on something set by Dan, who is now the Assistant Director of Routesetting at Movement’s Centennial facility. Dan is also a USAC Level 4 Setter and has set for Youth Nationals, National Cups and Vail Citizens competitions. He has also chiefed half a dozen youth championship events. Outside of climbing, Dan works in high rigging for concerts at major Colorado venues, such as Ball Arena. Above all else, he is a proud husband and father. General Topics Covered Show Notes Dan CornellaMovement x B-Pump Collaboration Brings Japanese Routesetting and Training to ColoradoRumble in the Rockies Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver Podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Essential Climbing and Strati. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

This episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast is a little historical. There is so much that is often recounted and celebrated related to the heritage and lineage of outdoor climbing, and there is an equally fascinating counterpart to that history with the history of indoor climbing. The wonderful industry that we have now with climbing gyms includes components that are largely unique to the indoor scene. Things like routesetting and artificial holds, coaches, comps…These elements didn't just appear suddenly in gyms; they had to germinate and develop over a long period of time. And that's not news to anyone who is listening to this podcast. It is worth pointing out that, more often than not, there was a person or a small group of people who were at the vanguard of those ideas and various developments. That background leads to today's guest, Mike Pont. Mike was one of the people leading the charge in the earliest days of indoor climbing, and particularly the earliest days of routesetting. He was among the first group of people in the United States who actually thought of themselves as routesetters in the late 1980s and early 1990s, when climbing gyms were few and far between. And Mike Pont, along with a few other people, helped make routesetting a concept and helped put it into practice. Mike was also involved in organizing some of the earliest large-scale climbing competitions in the U.S. and was involved in the climbing portion of the ESPN X Games. He basically had a front row seat for the generational turnover in sport climbing and in the climbing industry that occurred in the 90s. Mike and host John Burgman get into all those instrumental beginnings for our industry on today’s show. General Topics Covered Show Notes @mikepont1 Thank you EP Climbing and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen sits down with Nickolas Gagliardi to get us thinking about USAC events as routesetters gear up for the upcoming youth competition season. Nick started setting in 2015 in St. Paul, Minnesota. While that beginning was only ten years ago, Nick experienced the industry when many setters were still getting paid by the route and boulder, specifically: $7 a boulder, $11 a top-rope route, $15 a lead route and $26 for setting the roof. From there, Nick moved to Colorado where he set at the Earth Treks gyms—now Movement—before he finally landed in Portland, Oregon. Now, Nick is a USAC Level 3 routesetter and the Director of Setting at Portland Rock Gym. When he’s not setting, Nick is often climbing outdoors, playing video games, and trying to get better at Go. General Topics Covered Show Notes Nick GagliardiPortland Rock Gym2025 Youth National ChampionshipsUSA Climbing RoutesettersBoulder QE Setting GuidelinesTop Rope/Lead GuidelinesUSAC RulebookYou’re Stronger if You’re Honest: Behind the Wrench With Abby WilsonSetting the Tone: What Makes a Space Feel Good? – CBJ Podcast with Jesse SaffordNo One Sets Alone: Collective Authorship – CBJ Podcast with Ruth Jang“You Can Strip My Boulder.” – CBJ Podcast with Blake Green Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Kilter and Bold Climbing. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Megan Cheek, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today's podcast episode features an interview with gym founder Eric Hires. Eric is the co-owner of Stone Climbing, the first location of which opened in St. Augustine, Florida, several years ago. Now, there's a second Stone Climbing gym that is quickly approaching its grand opening in Jacksonville, Florida. Eric talks with host John Burgman about the development and the construction of both those gyms. The new Stone Climbing gym that's about to open in Jacksonville is a 16,000-square-foot ground-up build, with boulders and roped climbs. The focus of this conversation with Eric is on the challenges (and opportunities) inherent in opening a gym in a place like Florida, which certainly has some gym climbing history but doesn't have an outdoor climbing heritage per se. John was also curious to get Eric's insights on the lessons he learned from opening that first gym…and how Eric is applying those lessons to the opening of a second gym. So, keep listening to hear how jotting something down on a barroom napkin was crucial in the creation of Eric's gyms in Florida. General Topics Covered Show Notes @stoneclimbingco Thank you Approach and Strati for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this expansive episode of The Impact Driver Podcast, host Holly Chen brings on two setters—Nat Vorel and Mia DePaolis—to talk about paraclimbing and parasetting, diving into fundamentals and tips that any setter can put into practice. Nat Vorel is based in Oklahoma City and has been climbing for ten years, paraclimbing for around five of them. They are a four-time National Champion and have five World Cup podiums. Nat started setting five years ago and turned freelance recently. Nat has set for a variety of competitions, from local qualifiers and citizens comps to paraclimbing comps. They have a USAC L1 setting certification and an AMGA Single Pitch Instructor certification for guiding. Climbing and setting aside, Nat is a costume designer and would like to shout out their three tabby cats, whom they love dearly. Mia DePaolis is the Head Routesetter at Central Rock Gym in Randolph, Massachusetts. She has been climbing for over twenty years and setting for ten of those years. After hearing from some local paraclimbers, Mia began to run an annual paraclimbing comp, the Randolph Rumble, at CRG. She is a USAC Level 3 routesetter with only one more national event to go before obtaining the next level. She is also a certified sports nutrition coach. Outside of climbing and setting, Mia worked as a beekeeper for many years and continues to love bees. General Topics Covered Show Notes Nat Vorel on InstagramMia DePaolis on InstagramCentral Rock GymUSAC ParaclimbingUSAC Parasetting ClinicsIFSC ParaclimbingEhlers-Danlos SyndromesRandolph RumblePara Climbing Set to Make Paralympics Debut Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by EP Climbing and Trango. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host John Burgman checks out a new gym, ROQ, that is currently expected to open this fall in Seattle. The gym is quite unique in concept within the climbing gym industry, although somewhat par for the course in the fitness gym industry. Guest Michael Hauss is the founder and CEO of ROQ. The boutique climbing gym will feature high-intensity, hour-long workouts in a class setting, led by an instructor or trainer. In their conversation, Hauss and Burgman talk all about how the concept for the unique climbing gym came about, and how Hauss plans to run it in the vein of boutique fitness gyms with classes, instructors, and very high-intensity group training. General Topics Covered Show Notes ROQ@ROQClimbing Thank you Approach and Essential Climbing for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Jesse Safford (they/them) started climbing during college in Montana, but it wasn’t until they moved to Grand Rapids, Michigan, that they stumbled upon setting. Now Jesse is the Head Setter at Terra Firma. Jesse is also an avid comp setter, chiefing and setting their annual in-house Rabble Rouser competition at Terra Firma, and has set for Death Moth, Siege the Southeast and Flight of the Phoenix, among many others. Most recently, they’re extremely excited about the upcoming Midwest Mayhem series. Outside of climbing, Jesse is a birdwatcher, Dungeons and Dragons player, and cat parent. What does D&D have to do with working on a routesetting team? How can we all play a role in improving our team dynamics? Jesse and Holly dive into those topics and much more on today’s episode. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramTerra FirmaDeath MothSiege the SoutheastMidwest MayhemFlight of the PhoenixDungeons and Dragonsbattle strategy Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a next guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Approach and Trango. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

Today on the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host John Burgman meets with Jonathan Brandt. Jonathan is one of the co-founders of a new climbing gym in Holland, Michigan, called Shift. It's a 12,000-square-foot, bouldering-focused facility, and by Jonathan's own admission, there aren't a lot of bells and whistles in the gym, meaning there aren't a ton of fancy accouterments or amenities that are too far afield from climbing. Inside the space is primarily a bunch of really cool boulders and the community of staff and stoke that has developed around those blocks. Jonathan has been in or around the climbing industry for about 20 years. So, Shift’s founding comes with a lot of expertise and experience. You'll hear Jonathan explain how and why he felt the timing was right now, after all these years, to finally open his own gym. And he acknowledges there are a ton of other bouldering gyms out there right now. So, the question becomes: How do you stand out in this day and age? How do you set your new gym apart from the pack? There are several ways to answer that question, but Jonathan's contention is that, in the case of Shift, it has a lot to do with the staff you hire and the culture that staff helps to build. General Topics Covered Show Notes Shift@shiftclimbing Thank you Approach and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast, host Holly Chen sits down with Carly Snidow. Carly is a routesetter at Vital’s Lower East Side location in Manhattan, New York. She has been climbing for almost a decade, and her setting career started like many others—setting college climbing walls and bugging local routesetters. Now, Carly is a USAC Level 1 routesetter with a dozen competitions under her belt up to the divisionals level. She has set for several citizens' comps as well, including Siege the Southeast. Carly is also a coach and personal trainer. Prior to setting, Carly studied philosophy, neuroscience and psychology. She has extensive lab experience spanning multiple disciplines, from microbiology to behavioral neuroscience and developmental psychology. Carly brings that scientific lens to the show today, challenging how we think about goal setting and success in the routesetting field. General Topics Covered Show Notes InstagramVital, Lower East SideInductive LogicHippocampal and amygdala volumes vary with residential proximity to toxicants at Birmingham, Alabama's 35th Avenue Superfund site Closing Notes If you’d like to nominate someone as a guest, have a topic you want to see us tackle, or have questions, we’d love for you to reach out. The Impact Driver podcast is a production of the Climbing Business Journal. Today’s episode is sponsored by Butora and Essential Climbing. It was edited and produced by Holly Yu Tung Chen, Scott Rennak, and the team at CBJ. Our theme music is by Devin Dabney.

On this episode of the Climbing Business Journal Podcast, host Scott Rennak meets with Mark Grossman and Will Jorgensen of the Monument Sports Group. They manage the US Group Insurance Plan for our industry in partnership with the CWA, and they cover hundreds of climbing walls. Mark and Will have deep experience in facility operations. You'll hear on today’s show about their backgrounds, how they approach their insurance work, and the headwinds the indoor climbing industry is facing. General Topics Covered Show Notes CWA Insurance ProgramMonument Sports GroupDOXA Thank you OnSite and Rock Gym Pro for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!

Obe Carrion is the guest of this episode of the Climbing Business Journal podcast, hosted by John Burgman. Obe has long been one of the biggest names in the game as a pro climber. Over the years, he has worked with multiple brands, and he's been in multiple climbing films, including the 1998’s Free Hueco! and 1999’s Rampage. He has been a coach, a mentor, and through all of the evolutions he has remained a force of nature in the climbing industry. John and Obe talk about Obe’s career and psych in climbing: how psych is never a constant, but how there can be value in it as an unknown, and in the way that motivation comes and goes and then comes back again eventually. Obe also reflects on climbing in the 1990s, the filming of that famous Rampage documentary—in which Chris Sharma stole the show at an X Games in San Francisco on this day, 26 years ago—hanging with Sharma, coaching the next generation, and evolving with the times. General Topics Covered Show Notes @obe_carrionRampage on YouTube Thank you Approach and Kilter for your support! And thank you Devin Dabney for your music!